Trial For Griffiths, Judge Refuses To Drop Briton From Kidnap Case

[Mr Lee]

It seems by that statement below in red, that may be all they have, placing them in the vehicle by eye witnesses, and if that is all they have, then I would have to agree with Mark that the case is very weak, if only the supported by the supposed eye witnesses, yet if one of those eye witnesses has seen the couple numerous times before, around town or out and about or near the school, then I wish them luck trying to prove it was not them, but time will tell what supposed evidence they have against them. I for one am glad that it seems the trial may begin quickly, so if not guilty Santos would not have to spend a lot of time in jail as surmised by some that she would. Let us not forget that it would not be unusual, and in fact would be normal for someone to case a crime before committing it, so I await the evidence. The trial against Bella Ruby Santos will proceed even without her British boyfriend Ian Charles Griffiths. The court yesterday denied the request of defense lawyers to dismiss the charges against Griffiths, who is still abroad.“What kind of motion is that?” said Regional Trial Court Judge Ester Veloso of Branch 6 with surprise.“You mean all cases against the accused who are not arrested will be dismissed? Of course not. Otherwise, all the accused would just hide so the charges against them will be dismissed.” Griffiths, a 51-year-old accountant, has his named posted in the Interpol website's “red alert list” as being “Wanted by: Philippines.”The Interpol Red Notice sent earlier to the Cebu police described him as a “Fugitive wanted for prosecution.” Santos entered a plea of “not guilty” during her arraignment yesterday on charges of kidnapping and homicide in relation to the Feb. 8 disappearance of 6-year-old Ellah Joy Pique, a schoolgirl last seen alive accepting a car ride from strangers while walking home from school in Mingalanilla town.The little girl's body turned up the next day in a sack thrown down a ravine on the other side of Cebu island. Police investigators and prosecutors said they are ready with evidence to prove Santos and her British partner were the couple in the “Pajero” seen driving off with the schoolgirl. Santos has repeatedly said in interviews that the police have falsely accused them of the crime.Dressed in a yellow T-shirt, white jeans and white sneakers, Santos entered the court handcuffed and escorted by six jail guards at about 8:30 a.m.She was in full makeup and wore silver earrings.After conferring with four defense lawyers led by Rameses Villagonzalo, she stood in front of the judge while the charges were read to her.When asked how she would plead, Santos started to explain: “Your Honor, I did not kidnap . . .”She was interrupted by the judge who told her, “Don't explain. Just answer whether you're guilty or not.”Santos quickly answered “not guilty.” The court denied the request of defense lawyer Ronel Ubod to dismiss the charges against Griffiths.Since the Briton has not been arrested, defense lawyers pointed out that the court has no jurisdiction over him.But the judge said she could not simply dismiss the charges against the Briton due to the failure of law enforcers to arrest him. The judge gave 10 days for the prosecution to comment on the motion to grant Santos bail and a request for marathon hearings.The hearing is set on Nov. 15. Efforts to process a “government-to-government” request to Great Britain to send Griffiths to Cebu is still being processed by the Department of Justice, said Cebu Provincial Prosecutor Pepita Jane Petralba earlier.There is no extradition treaty between Great Britain and the Philippines but the Philippine Center on Transnational Crime directed the Cebu Provincial Police Office director to process the papers so Griffiths will be brought back to the country. .

[Markham]

Lee, for once I have to agree with your opening sentence! However, what is more concerning is that by not dropping the charges against Griffiths for the current case (they can always be re-imposed later, should he be extradited), the Judge may be intending to try him in absentia since the current set of charges is against them both. That could be diplomatically unwise if the DoJ intends to pursue the Mutual Legal Assistance request. The trial isn't going to start any time soon. The next hearing, scheduled for 15th November, is for the Prosecutions' response to the Bail motion and also the Prosecutions' comments in respect of the request for "marathon hearings". Mark

Edited October 24, 2011 by Markham

[Mr Lee]

Lee, for once I have to agree with your opening sentence! However, what is more concerning is that by not dropping the charges against Griffiths for the current case (they can always be re-imposed later, should he be extradited), the Judge may be intending to try him in absentia since the current set of charges is against them both. That could be diplomatically unwise if the DoJ intends to pursue the Mutual Legal Assistance request. Mark

I have to agree that it seems like what Garpo has been saying may come to pass, they will get her to roll on him and may try him even without him in the Philippines. Of course we are all just speculating and will have to sit back and wait to see what happens, but if it should come to pass, what I wrote in past posts about some of us feeling their wrath may also come to pass, if they do not get there way, so while your govt may not feel they have to comply because of their laws, it is my feelings the Philippine govt will feel the same way and spite them even more. The old story is that if you cannot catch one fish then you can catch lots of others and use them for bargaining bait. Mark I always try to be fair and balanced in my postings, it just seems that you and I have a failure to communicate often on the words I use or you use. Edit to add, also them not dropping the charges should make his travels much harder, and I am guessing that is what they wish to do. Edited October 24, 2011 by Mr. Lee
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[Markham]

Lee, for once I have to agree with your opening sentence! However, what is more concerning is that by not dropping the charges against Griffiths for the current case (they can always be re-imposed later, should he be extradited), the Judge may be intending to try him in absentia since the current set of charges is against them both. That could be diplomatically unwise if the DoJ intends to pursue the Mutual Legal Assistance request. Mark

I have to agree that it seems like what Garpo has been saying may come to pass, they will get her to roll on him and may try him even without him in the Philippines. Of course we are all just speculating and will have to sit back and wait to see what happens, but if it should come to pass, what I wrote in past posts about some of us feeling their wrath may also come to pass, if they do not get there way, so while your govt may not feel they have to comply because of their laws, it is my feelings the Philippine govt will feel the same way and spite them even more. The old story is that if you cannot catch one fish then you can catch lots of others and use them for bargaining bait. Mark I always try to be fair and balanced in my postings, it just seems that you and I have a failure to communicate often on the words I use or you use. Edit to add, also them not dropping the charges should make his travels much harder, and I am guessing that is what they wish to do.

How so? He is free to travel anywhere in the world he chooses - but he probably would avoid the Philippines right now. His Passport was returned to him when he was released from Police Bail and the Police File about the case has been closed and archived. As far as the British authorities are concerned, there isn't a stain on his character nor any reason to deny his rights to travel. I very much doubt that Santos is going to "roll on him" as you so quaintly put it. Why should she when she is as innocent as he is? If she does that, then she implicates herself (in a crime she didn't commit) and would face a lengthy jail term. Remember that under the system here, the accuser - Pique - does have some say and he, I am sure, wouldn't agree to any amnesty deal when it is claimed that a female invited Ellah Joy into the vehicle in the first place. Nor, I suggest, would the Governor agree. If the female half of the duo was simply a passenger in the car at the time Ellah Joy was abducted - meaning the male enticed her to board the vehicle - then you may have a valid point. She could do a deal and become a Prosecution witness since she wasn't actually involved in the commissioning of the crime. Mark Edited October 24, 2011 by Markham

[Markham]

Lee, for once I have to agree with your opening sentence! However, what is more concerning is that by not dropping the charges against Griffiths for the current case (they can always be re-imposed later, should he be extradited), the Judge may be intending to try him in absentia since the current set of charges is against them both. That could be diplomatically unwise if the DoJ intends to pursue the Mutual Legal Assistance request. Mark

I have to agree that it seems like what Garpo has been saying may come to pass, they will get her to roll on him and may try him even without him in the Philippines. Of course we are all just speculating and will have to sit back and wait to see what happens, but if it should come to pass, what I wrote in past posts about some of us feeling their wrath may also come to pass, if they do not get there way, so while your govt may not feel they have to comply because of their laws, it is my feelings the Philippine govt will feel the same way and spite them even more. The old story is that if you cannot catch one fish then you can catch lots of others and use them for bargaining bait. Mark I always try to be fair and balanced in my postings, it just seems that you and I have a failure to communicate often on the words I use or you use. Edit to add, also them not dropping the charges should make his travels much harder, and I am guessing that is what they wish to do.

The Philippine Government knows exactly the terms under which persons may be extradited between the United Kingdom and the Republic of the Philippines because a senior member of the Arroyo Government agreed to and signed the Extradition Treaty. They can not subsequently cry "foul" if the UK acts in accordance with that Treaty - even though it actually has no legal effect in either country right now. Mark

[Mr Lee]

How so? He is free to travel anywhere in the world he chooses - but he probably would avoid the Philippines right now. His Passport was returned to him when he was released from Police Bail and the Police File about the case has been closed and archived. As far as the British authorities are concerned, there isn't a stain on his character nor any reason to deny his rights to travel. I very much doubt that Santos is going to "roll on him" as you so quaintly put it. Why should she when she is as innocent as he is? If she does that, then she implicates herself (in a crime she didn't commit) and would face a lengthy jail term. Remember that under the system here, the accuser - Pique - does have some say and he, I am sure, wouldn't agree to any amnesty deal when it is claimed that a female invited Ellah Joy into the vehicle in the first place. Nor, I suggest, would the Governor agree. If the female half of the duo was simply a passenger in the car at the time Ellah Joy was abducted - meaning the male enticed her to board the vehicle - then you may have a valid point. She could do a deal and become a Prosecution witness since she wasn't actually involved in the commissioning of the crime. Mark

Most if not all countries will have it listed in their computers, so either they may reject his entry, or they may watch his every move, either way he may be free to leave his country but with a murder hanging over his head, which country is going to want to let him in? Put yourself in their shoes, what if he was guilty and killed again and they let him in, many heads would roll. As you wrote, if Santos had no part in the murder and can explain away why she invited the child into the car (that is of course if it was even her) then I am pretty sure the father would then be happy to catch the big fish and let the small fry go, after all they would much rather have a foreigner in jail than one of their own, I know I would let her go if I was the father and if it could be proved to me that the person was an unknowing accomplice. There are so many possibilities and scenarios that could have happened, if they are the ones who picked up the child. There have been accidental killings where a person was killed with no intention to kill and then followed the cover up, so if something like that happened, then that is when the partner rolls over. The vehicle could have even stopped short and the girl hit the dashboard and died from the impact, and then they panicked, but I will not go into more what ifs, I will just say that it happens more often than most people ever hear about, where one partner can convince the police that they had no part in the death except being there, or one partner is even willing to lie to get off or get a lighter sentence. Anyway when faced with life in prison, even innocent persons have been know to cop a plea to get a lighter sentence. Time will tell and I am surely not saying Santos or Griffiths is guilty.

[Markham]

The vehicle could have even stopped short and the girl hit the dashboard and died from the impact, and then they panicked

Now that's an interesting theory but not one that would work in this case, I'm afraid. However: Riddle me this: The time of death was 11pm and it's alleged she died in Santos' house in Bgy Inayagan which is actually midway between Minglanilla and Naga City. It's a largish barangay but only populated close to the South Road where the houses are typically cheek-by-jowl. It is also alleged that Griffiths was spotted taking her body from the rear of the Pajero at 11.50pm at Sayaw Beach, about 1km west of Barili Town proper. You may recall that her naked body was wrapped in a sheet and large stones placed inside before the bundle was tightly secured with several internet cables. Her neatly folded clothes and two 50 Peso notes were placed in her school bag which also contained her school notebook. The road from Carcar to Barili is uphill all the way - and steeply so a few kilometres west of Carcar - and very twisty as it crosses the central mountains with several hairpin bends. The distance between the two locations is 46 kilometres. Given that neither Grifiths nor Santos are known assassins or hardened criminals, had they killed her, there would doubtless be a commotion (screams etc) which nobody heard or reported and having killed her, they would both be in a state of deep shock and likely to pacing around for a few minutes wondering what the hell to do next. A plan of action would slowly have emerged whereby they would wrap the body in a sheet and weigh it with stones and try to get rid of it in a river or at some deserted spot near the sea. But where? Unless they knew for sure that there were cliffs at Sayaw Beach (which is, I suggest, doubtful), they'd probably choose a spot on the more deserted coast south of Carcar. Of course, they could have gone online and brought-up the WikiMapia page for Cebu, zoomed in and checked for likely spots, It is only at maximum zoom - which shows a small area - does the map show that the road just west of Barili Town proper passes right next to a cliff but you'd need to use the satellite photo overlay to see this and that slows down the map rendering. Meanwhile the clock is ticking. Having found a place, they then prepare the body, secure it and take it outside to put in the rear of the Pajero - but wait, it's a short wheelbase vehicle and the space behind the rear seat is too small to place anything as large as a child's body. So they have to fold-down the back seat and then climb inside and roll the rear seat cushion forwards through a 90 degree angle. Now I've owned one of those cars in the past, and it's a fiddly job getting the rear seat folded away, it's a two-person job. Meanwhile the clock is still ticking. Having put the body in the car they've yet to unlock and open the gates (and almost all houses do have locked gates) reverse the vehicle into the road, close and lock the gates and then drive off gently so as not to cause suspicion. Would you agree that at this point it is likely that at least 30 minutes have passed? As I said earlier, it is exactly 46 kilometres from Santos' house to the spot at Sayaw Beach. Given that Santos' vehicle appears to be a petrol-driven, old model with 4 speed automatic transmission - not the pokiest vehicles on the road and very heavy for its size - based on estimates from 3 locals and one expat who know the area well, it would have taken them between one hour and one and a half-hours to make that trip - bearing in mind the road conditions, the inevitable hold-ups at Carcar and likely traffic conditions. That would mean that the earliest they could have arrived at Sayaw Beach would be half-past midnight and very likely later than that. So, how did the two witnesses manage to see them at 11.50pm? Even if they left the very moment they had killed Ellah Joy, they still would not have arrived by that time!! The above is all factual and mostly in the public domain. I have deliberately made it one paragraph because I want you to read it carefully, preferably several times, before attempting to answer. Mark Edited October 24, 2011 by Markham

[Mr Lee]

Now that's an interesting theory but not one that would work in this case, I'm afraid. However: Riddle me this: The time of death was 11pm and it's alleged she died in Santos' house in Bgy Inayagan which is actually midway between Minglanilla and Naga City. It's a largish barangay but only populated close to the South Road where the houses are typically cheek-by-jowl. It is also alleged that Griffiths was spotted taking her body from the rear of the Pajero at 11.50pm at Sayaw Beach, about 1km west of Barili Town proper. You may recall that her naked body was wrapped in a sheet and large stones placed inside before the bundle was tightly secured with several internet cables. Her neatly folded clothes and two 50 Peso notes were placed in her school bag which also contained her school notebook. The road from Carcar to Barili is uphill all the way - and steeply so a few kilometres west of Carcar - and very twisty as it crosses the central mountains with several hairpin bends. The distance between the two locations is 46 kilometres. Given that neither Grifiths nor Santos are known assassins or hardened criminals, had they killed her, there would doubtless be a commotion (screams etc) which nobody heard or reported and having killed her, they would both be in a state of deep shock and likely to pacing around for a few minutes wondering what the hell to do next. A plan of action would slowly have emerged whereby they would wrap the body in a sheet and weigh it with stones and try to get rid of it in a river or at some deserted spot near the sea. But where? Unless they knew for sure that there were cliffs at Sayaw Beach (which is, I suggest, doubtful), they'd probably choose a spot on the more deserted coast south of Carcar. Of course, they could have gone online and brought-up the WikiMapia page for Cebu, zoomed in and checked for likely spots, It is only at maximum zoom - which shows a small area - does the map show that the road just west of Barili Town proper passes right next to a cliff but you'd need to use the satellite photo overlay to see this and that slows down the map rendering. Meanwhile the clock is ticking. Having found a place, they then prepare the body, secure it and take it outside to put in the rear of the Pajero - but wait, it's a short wheelbase vehicle and the space behind the rear seat is too small to place anything as large as a child's body. So they have to fold-down the back seat and then climb inside and roll the rear seat cushion forwards through a 90 degree angle. Now I've owned one of those cars in the past, and it's a fiddly job getting the rear seat folded away, it's a two-person job. Meanwhile the clock is still ticking. Having put the body in the car they've yet to unlock and open the gates (and almost all houses do have locked gates) reverse the vehicle into the road, close and lock the gates and then drive off gently so as not to cause suspicion. Would you agree that at this point it is likely that at least 30 minutes have passed? As I said earlier, it is exactly 46 kilometres from Santos' house to the spot at Sayaw Beach. Given that Santos' vehicle appears to be a petrol-driven, old model with 4 speed automatic transmission - not the pokiest vehicles on the road and very heavy for its size - based on estimates from 3 locals and one expat who know the area well, it would have taken them between one hour and one and a half-hours to make that trip - bearing in mind the road conditions, the inevitable hold-ups at Carcar and likely traffic conditions. That would mean that the earliest they could have arrived at Sayaw Beach would be half-past midnight and very likely later than that. So, how did the two witnesses manage to see them at 11.50pm? Even if they left the very moment they had killed Ellah Joy, they still would not have arrived by that time!! The above is all factual and mostly in the public domain. I have deliberately made it one paragraph because I want you to read it carefully, preferably several times, before attempting to answer. Mark

Time of death can be off by different amounts of time depending on many things, one of which is does the Santos house have a freezer? Mind you I am not an expert on TOD. We can speculate all day long and come of with many scenarios but locking it down to an exact time is possibly something the local police may not have the ability to do. So let me ask you, if she died earlier than first thought and they put her body in a freeze until they prepared the vehicle, how would that fit your time line. Edited October 24, 2011 by Mr. Lee
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[Garpo]

There is no way that anybody can say that the time of death was 11pm. A liver temp can put you with in about an hour but that is as close as you are going to get. As Lee as stated, the temp of the house, the temp of the vehicle where the body would have been placed, the temp of the area where the body was left all play into it. She very well could have been killed at 10pm. It is also possible that she was not killed at the house and could have been killed in the vehicle or some other location.

[Markham]

Time of death can be off by different amounts of time depending on many things, one of which is does the Santos house have a freezer? Mind you I am not an expert on TOD.

The Time of Death was confirmed by Post Mortem conducted by a Police Surgeon. I'm not saying they don't exist here and although I have seen chest freezers for sale, they have tended to be really quite small and probably too small to place a body of her stature. However I think it's highly unlikely that there was such a freezer available. How many people would know that freezing a body can delay the onset of rigor mortis? Furthermore, IF there were such a freezer, there would likely be traces of blood within it and the Police would surely have found that when they searched Bella's house. The only blood found was on a mattress (and it was Bella's). You could argue that they cleaned the freezer - but she seemingly made no attempt to remove the blood from the mattress (as well). In my opinion, the reality is that it is rather unlikely that anyone could come up with an explanation that would hold water. Mark