Why Americans Are Not Retiring In Philippines

[mofungo]

Many just cannot stomach the idea of being on a plane for 14 plus hours. Those with prior military backgrounds or with ties to the Philippines would consider it I would think.I am always seeing articles about best foreign places for retiree's. Philippines is never on the list. They break down all the various costs. Those articles online show up about every 2 or 3 months.

I agree, most Yanks would keep to their hemisphere. Other more adventurous sorts may make it to Asia, but few. Most would go to Panama, Costa Rica, Dominican Republic, to name a few.

Advertising and visas. I took a bus today from Argao to Carcar and back, should be about 30 minutes each way. Every bus was standing room, maybe Holy Week, but couldn't they plan and put more buses during peak times. Finally got an "off name" ancient bus to stop but got off after 5 minutes because the driver appeared to be either on drugs or insane. Had a strange "faraway" look. Took a jeepney the rest of the way, crowded but not that bad. When I finally got to Carcar the one ATM in the Gaisano "mall" was out of money. Went to the grocey store, wala this wala that, as usual. Tried to use my debit card to purchase groceries as I have many times because the ATM was not working, that also not working so used up what little cash I had left to buy groceries. Going back I had 3 and 4 rotating chicharon salesmen screaming the entire time and had to crawl over them and a huge sack of "something" that was in the middle of the aisle, blocking the exit to get off the damn bus. Oppressively hot, humid, and packed. Older people visiting here from the west are going to get a taste of the real life and go running back in droves to Fl, Az, or Mexico. They will have some funny stories to tell their friends though.

Haha, Okinawa is looking better and better lol. Great info guys! keep up the good work.

[MikeB]

My wife and I are planning a two weeks road trip visiting continuing care retirement communities in California, Nevada and Arizona. I suspect the Philippine tycoons are planning something similar. Once you enter gated CCRC resorts, you are in a different world. There are impoverished communities in all three states except my wife and I won't see them from the freeway between CCRC resorts.

The "continuing care" concept could work well here because those things are insanely expensive in the west and, as you said, " the Philippines deployed overseas 6,000 nurses. That same year, the nursing schools graduated over 90,000 nursing students". They face a catch 22 because they can't get jobs w/o experience but they can't get experience w/o jobs. So they are forced to work for free to gain experience. That you describe the Philippine investors/owners as "tycoons" says something about their probable allegiances.

"Add pensions from either a defined benefit plan or defined contribution plan (401k, IRA, SEP-IRA, Roth-IRA, etc.), the average American retiree receives $2,900 a month."

I don't know where they got this number, this article puts it at $29,214 annually or $2434 monthly, that was in 2008 so it could have gone up (or down) slightly since. I found a few other sources that stated it was $29k annually or about the same. A $500 a month difference is huge to someone on a fixed income.

[gottawannalive]

$150,000.00 and up for retirement income for lawyers? Hell, I'm a lawyer and never cleared $150,000.00 in a single year. Better refine your research. If you'd like to do a field trip to supplement your research, I'll show you my county with all of the closed law offices, closed title companies, closed businesses and attorneys going home early afternoon as there is no work. Hahahahahaha $150,000.00 a year retirement income? I'm still laughing. Or maybe dreaming.

[Mike S]

the average American retiree receives $2,900 a month."

Afraid this is just a numbers game .... there are hundreds of thousands of Americans only living on their SS and hundreds of thousands more that have never had any type of retirement plan ...... but if you take in consideration just a hand full of politicians with their self-proclaimed salaries of $100,000 of dollars a year the picture looks mighty rosy ..... and then add to that the executives earning ten times that amount in retirement and you quickly see why the figures of the average retired person is so high ..... and then the few with the foresight to have 2-3 retirement plans .... military .. civil service .... 401k plus SS then yes they will be approaching and maybe surpassing that figure .... but of the people I worked with for the past 12 years I worked these few amounted to about 5 out of 250 employees .... and of those 5 I don't know a single one that would even consider coming to the Philippines ..... There is a good reason why Pilipinas are not excepted for nursing in the US ..... it is because they can't pass the board exam in the US ..... 99% of them have to work as CNA's (Certified Nursing Assistants) until the exam is passed and ONLY those that the medical community are allowed to even proceed to the US to enter this field (my ex-wife was an RN and worked with a lot of these girls in Florida) ..... sadly a lot were returned to the Philippines ..... so although there maybe a lot of nurses here in the Phils unemployed just how many are truly qualified ..... under US guide lines most are just qualified to change bed pans and give sponge baths .... on a happier note a bunch of US nursing graduates can't pass them either ....

[JJReyes]

The "continuing care" concept could work well here because those things are insanely expensive in the west and, as you said, " the Philippines deployed overseas 6,000 nurses. That same year, the nursing schools graduated over 90,000 nursing students".

The nurses are still being deployed overseas, but not as RN. The hospitals and clinic would have to pay them the same wages as a local hire. Canada has 10,000 visas per year for caregivers. These are for highly skilled workers who are paid minimum wage based on the each province's labor laws. The same for Israel. They have 10,000 visas a year, ninety percent are issued to Phiippine caregivers. The Israeli pay is $1,000 to $1,500 and the jobs are highly sought after because other Middle East countries like Saudi Arabia pay $400 to $600 per month. The United Kingdom has 150,000 Philippine workers from medical doctors to registred nurses to caregivers. Those who can't make it work for the Business Process Outsourcing industry doing medical transcriptions.By the way, overseas workers are starting to unionized. Employers expect mostly Filipinas to work 10 to 12 hours a day, 365 days a year. The advocacy groups finally negotiated a one day break (I think it is either once a week or once every two weeks) for workers in Taiwan and Singapore. The families in Taiwan and Singapore are mad as hell. Their reasoning is the Filipinas will just get pregnant if you give them a day off. The reality is the employers will have to do the work of caring for the children or the elderly during the day off.

I don't know where they got this number, this article puts it at $29,214 annually or $2434 monthly, that was in 2008 so it could have gone up (or down) slightly since.

Thank you for the link. The data I cited eliminated those in America who receive zero Social Secuirty. They include the Amish Pennslyvania Dutch and other exempt religious groups. The Amish family and community provide for their elders through the practice of intergenerational housing. Another zero group are inmates in federal, state, county and city jails. Social Security requires 40 quarters or 10 years of contribution to qualify for benefits. Recent iimmigrants maybe short. Undocumented workers may have been contributing through payroll deductions, but they don't qualify for benefits. And then there are those who are in a "cash only" business. This might be the reason why the numbers I cited are higher.

$150,000.00 and up for retirement income for lawyers? Hell, I'm a lawyer and never cleared $150,000.00 in a single year.

There are also retired firefighters in Orange County who receive more than $100,000 a year in pension. A person with a Ph.D. teaching at a community college maybe receiving $40,000 a year. For others in a prestigious university, it could be $250,000. I was surprised to learn that the highest paid (take home income) medical professional is a Radiologist. I always thought it was a Surgeon, but his liability insurance can be as high as $1,000 per working day. The data was statistical averaging for "professionals" which includes Wall Street types who receive $1 million a year pensions.

there are hundreds of thousands of Americans only living on their SS and hundreds of thousands more that have never had any type of retirement plan ......

In preparing my business plan, I eliminated the bottom 30% of Americans who don't have enough money to retire. This group is a big problem for the federal and state governments and the Medicaid program. The upper 20% bracket would never consider the Philippines. The wealthier ones might buy a vacation home possibly in Antigua, Belize, Jamaica, the American Virgin Islands, etc. They also have sufficient resources to pay the fees for continuing care retirement communities. You will be shocked how much some of them cost. The market I hope to develop is someone who can afford $2,000 a month for a facility in the Philippine, which includes three meals plus two snacks a day, and medical care. The same caregiving facility in the United States would be $6,000 minimum. Then they nickel and dime you for everything. Request for a glass of orange juice, that's $6 extra charge in your monthly statement.

There is a good reason why Pilipinas are not excepted for nursing in the US ..... it is because they can't pass the board exam in the US

I agree. There are many so called, "diploma mills" in the Philippines. If you tell me you are a graduate of the University of the Philippines, you are more likely highly qualified. Of course, the claim has to be verified by contacting the university.

on a happier note a bunch of US nursing graduates can't pass them either ....

I also agree. Hawaii is so desperate for caregivers, a politician proposed offering scholarships even if the person does not have a high school diploma. It was worthy of a good laugh. A significant portion of Hawaii's population are functional illiterates. They cannot read or write beyond a fourth grade level. We do volunteer work in an impoverished community with a non-profit group. A few 18 year olds have kindergarten level reading skills. They could get driver's licenses until the state finally plugged the loophole. How they could read roadway directional and warning signs is a mystery. Edited April 4, 2012 by JJR

[Mike S]

JJR .... I assume what you are talking about opening here is an ACLF (Assisted Care Living Facility) and not a nursing home ..... I have spent 17 years in management in these as well as hospitals ..... one of the big selling items in Florida is high rises that offer apartments ..... ACLF and finally nursing homes ..... you start out with an apartment and as you digress you are sent to the ACLF and finally the nursing home ..... the theory is you never have to leave your home as they are all combined in the same complex .... I was the Director of Environmental Services of a huge one in Cape Coral ..... on the business side it went something like this ..... examples only not sure of exact cost now ...$100,000 one time fee ..... 1 bedroom apart with kitchen ... living room .... bedroom and balcony ...... when you left you received no money back this also included if you had to be relocated to the ACLF or nursing home ..... also a monthly maintenance fee of $5000 which was of course never recovered in any plan .....$150,000 one time fee ...... same apartment as above and maintenance fee ... but ... after 10 yrs. you or your heirs would receive 1/2 or $75,000$200,000 one time fee ...... same apartment as above and maintenance fee ... but ... after 10 years you or your heirs would get 100% of your money backThere were 1 .. 2.. and 3 bedroom models to choose from and of course the price became more expensive the bigger they were .....there were planned activities and an executive dinning room where you got one free meal a day (your choice of which meal) ..... most chose the evening meal as it involved dinning with their friends and it was formal wear .....Don't remember the cost of the ACLF or Nursing home ....There are tons of other stuff but you get the idea ..... also this was more that 20 years ago so I'm sure prices have change accordingly ..... used to have pictures but during my change over from XP to Win7 all my old pictures were wiped out ..... and I'm still crying about that ..... oh well no excuse for ignorance ..... :541: :)

[JJReyes]

Hi Mike S,Thank you for the information. I will definitely include a visit to Cebu on my next trip to meet with you and other forum members. There might even be a way for some forum members to supplement their retirement income. One of my Manila meetings is with a law firm. My question, "If the reimbursement for services is from an off-shore company and it is paid to a foreign national who performs the service in the Philippines, would that be a violation of Philippine labor laws?" The Assisted Care Living Facility is now called, "Continuing Care Retirement Communities." The idea remains the same. You sell your single family home since the children are grown and have moved out. The proceeds are used to purchase an apartment/condo in a warm climate area like Florida. The retiree starts as independent living and progresses to assisted living to nursing care. The apartment/condo could be a stand alone building or part of a resort complex.My personal plan is to limit myself to providing information and referral services about overseas retirement care. But I will work closely with investment groups who would like to construct and operate retirement facilities. The nearly one year of research and study seems to indicate there is a potential market. I am now ready for step two, which is to create the website and promote it. Ideas are good, but more important is to test and make sure it works.It won't be a Kevin Costner sports movie, "Build it and they will come." I need a total of 50 beds in existing Philippine nursing homes to promote to primary caregivers in Hawaii whose father or mother has Alzheimer's. This is a pilot program. If there is no market response, I can drop it like a hot potato. The publisher for a Honolulu magazine focused on helping Hawaii seniors thinks I will get 100 emails and phone calls a day. We shall see.My motivation is profit. I have also dreamed about becoming a philanthropist in the Philippines upon my retirement, but I don't have the money. Next best thing is a business that can create many jobs. The multiplier effect of direct and indirect jobs I am using is five for every retiree who needs assisted care. A land developer I met thinks it is closer to eight.

Edited April 5, 2012 by JJR

[Mike Farrell]

I have lived in the Philippines, Cagayan de Oro, full time for the past sixteen years. I have never left. I am extremely active in the local ex-pat community, and in the past, was a major writing contributor to various ex-pat forums. I have met, face to face with well over 400 "foreigners" living in, or passing througn CDO over the years.In this forum, someone mentioned retirement income. I have met ONE foreigner whose retirement income is $5,000 per month, MOST are less than $2,000. Many would "kill" to have a $2,000 per month pension. . Also in your health computations, MEDICARE is NOT available overseas.Someone commented on an uninterrupted two year stay. YES! But what does it cost with two month renewals, before having to leave the country and start the cycle over again. (I never left, I am a permanent resident and pay my P310 registration fee every year.)I have been a tourist, but have never before lived anyplace else but the US. Here in the Philippines, no matter how long you live here , regardless of what you do, you will ALWAYS be looked down upon upon and taken advantage of, as a "foreigner"."Foreigners" are not welcome here, send your money, and stay home.Mike FarrellCagayan de Oro

[JJReyes]

"Foreigners" are not welcome here, send your money, and stay home.

Overseas retirement care is only an idea at this time. You might be right. I could fall flat on my face promoting a service no one wants. It's still worth a try.One of my Philippine associates is an entrepreneurial medical doctor. He opened the first medical clinic on the 3rd floor of one of the largest SM malls. Everyone predicted the clinic would close within six months from lack of customers. Other medical clinics are now relocating inside malls. Filipinos take care of their elderly relatives. The concept of nursing homes is alien. This doctor has already opened 8 nursing homes and he is looking for additional locations. Middle class Filipinos won't purchase medical insurance. Yet his company sells them like hot cakes to Filipino workers deploying overseas. They want reassurance their families have access to pre-paid medical care.There is a study that 200,000 Fil-Ams want to return home in retirement. They won't because Medicare benefits are not available overseas. What many do not understand is Medicare insurance is an 80% - 20% co-payment system. Medicare A, B, C & D is not free. It dawned on me only after reading the fine print. The reason why Obamacare is 1,800 pages long is to discourage the public from reading it. Wait till it's implemented in 2014, unless the US Supreme Court strikes it down as unconstritutional.I am bringing to the Philippines for the good doctor and his medical group two inches of brochures and printed information on Medicare. They want to offer an affordable insurance plan that will duplicate Medicare A, B, C & D. Forget you spent an entire lifetime paying into a government mandated plan. One study estimates a retired couple will spend an additional $240,000 in medical fees during their lifetime. This is over and above Medicare contributions, which like Social Security, requires 40 quarters of payments to qualify. Edited April 9, 2012 by JJR