Thief Of 26P(26.5) Lands Hungry Worker In Jail

[i am bob]

You're right Mike - a lot of us are or were Managers.

One thing we all forgot to take into consideration is the "Mob Mentality per Locale" bit... In other words, what the general thoughts on what is acceptable or not. Some areas you will find that people will generally be happy with management declaring the rules and abiding by them. Other areas we will find complete lack of respect for anybody and the general thought is that rules are meant to be broken. Why do I bring this up? Simple! In the first area, a manager can be more forgiving and act more like a parent rather than a boss. In the second example, a manager has to be Judge Dredd and terminate anyone who looks the left instead of right.

So for all the replies above no matter how severe or light they were? They could all be the correct answer depending on the store employees' attitudes towards management and the rules.

[Mike S]

So true Bob ..... I left management when I was told I could no longer treat employees as individuals but had to go strictly by the book .... if the book said hang'um that is what they wanted ...... so why hire a qualified experience manager .... a robot or college grad right out of school could do it ... and a lot cheaper .... if all you had to do was read it from a book and not from actual experience ..... if you could teach a monkey to read he could do it too ..... all he would have to do is open the book and say "sorry Jim ... it says here that making noise is a hanging offense ..... and as you were singing tomorrow we hang you" ..... (oh by the way I have heard some people singing here in the Phils that should be hung ... :mocking: ) :hystery: :hystery: :hystery:

[Jake]

So true Bob ..... I left management when I was told I could no longer treat employees as individuals but had to go strictly by the book .... if the book said hang'um that is what they wanted ...... so why hire a qualified experience manager .... a robot or college grad right out of school could do it ... and a lot cheaper .... if all you had to do was read it from a book and not from actual experience ..... if you could teach a monkey to read he could do it too ..... all he would have to do is open the book and say "sorry Jim ... it says here that making noise is a hanging offense ..... and as you were singing tomorrow we hang you" ..... (oh by the way I have heard some people singing here in the Phils that should be hung ... :mocking: ) :hystery: :hystery: :hystery:

Well, good morning boys and girls. I'm on my 2nd cup of coffee (with Kahlua of course) so I'm in a good mood (nasty)

to respond to Mike S'sss post.

Rereading the OP, I think there are couple issues being discussed here. One is enforcing store policy by strictly following

it to the letter. No warnings or grace period. The other issue is whether the PNP should have been involved. Let's start

with the PNP.....first question comes to mind -- is this teenager still in jail? And for what may I ask -- a bag of chips and

the poor (and still hungry) teenager is still in jail? Is by the book method apply a balance between punishment and crime?

I tend to agree with Kevin (Sonjack) that we have to put things in perspective. However, if you notice your inventory quickly

disappearing with no increase in sales over a period of time, perhaps another employee meeting with a final and more stern

warning. In many sari-sari stores-small businesses, often times the family members or relatives are stealing behind your back.

Additionally some Filipinos do not understand or maintain a balance sheet. The word budget is not in the Filipino mind set.

Some would rather eat the profits by chasing women, drinking spree, karaoke, majong and playing sabong.

One final note -- this Filipino can't sing to save his life and much more noticeable is that I'm not hung like a horse anymore.....

Dirty old goat -- Jake

[Thomas]

imagine what strong unions would do for the laborers in this country.

Sure the Philippines need some stronger unions. The employment rules are redicilous, because if the employment is shorter than (1 year ?) the employer don't need to pay some, so many employers systematicly give workers only short employments and then exchange them :angry:

I don't know if that's the reason many employed obviously don't bother do their best.

---

Employer-employee problem is very important for me, I know how to do things in Europe, I'm used to my teams produce at least 1.5 times as much as average (in each situation), but I don't know yet how to reach that in the Philippines, much depending of "Lose face" culture is so important in the Philippines, I'm still thinking how to solve things best. It can be very risky to state an example in public, because of that, but at the same time I want to use it if needed... :unsure: :)

I want my employee to think good for the company THEMSELVES, because

mostly instructions would be to complicated if trying to make them cover all situations

plus I don't want to need to check them all the time for ever :mocking:

(/In my first boss work I saw them all the time and kept them rather short,

/but in my company they had to work much spread geographicaly (distribution) so I couldn't check them all the time anyway :) But I could do random quality checks afterwards. They where many (70 - 115) so sometimes there were rutten apples found doing wrong on purpouse taking big shortcuts making big errors. Depending of reaction when I told them about the error, I fired them without pay. (In that business it's common to find 5% errors OK, but I volontaringly pay punnishment "fees" to my customer if we had more than 2%. Some of the cheaters made much more error than 5% too, so the punnishment fees were biger than what they had for salary.) Or if they reacted good enough, then I let them stay, because then they knew I check them proper... After got things proper started, I even had jobs running "automatic" without I needed to do anything more than send salaries and the invoice :dance: (From my customer > desk top > printshop > driver > distributors > My customer asked his customer if they had got the deliveries. So I needed only to replace ill or check things proper if customer found some error, which they seldom did, because mostly it functioned smoothly.)

/Later I lead software production in Russia me being in Sweden :mocking: I started with telling them I don't bother how much they (say they) ARE working, I bother about how much they GET DONE. In the beginning I asked them much, so they knew I kept an eye on them. Plus I instructed them how to think and act so we get a good developed computer program. It took a while before they started thinking good by themselves, but then it run rather smoothly.)

="Freedom with responcibility".

So now I "only" need to figuere out how to reach that in the Philppines, preferingly without being stabbed by someone I have fired because of having to bad working morale :) IF I will need to fire anyone. I hope I can get enough local assistance, when picking the employed, to get good enough employee. But as "reserve" I plan to give them short "Test employments" in the beginning, so it's possible to get rid of them e g if they don't realy do any obvious bad, but have to bad working morale attitude. "One rotten apple can make the whole basket rott" so better try to keep them out of the basket :)

Plus I plan to give some to sharity, HOPING it will give as side effect it make village find me and my business "of limit" for criminals (=As Bruce where he do his sharity work.) Plus I will tell the village the goal is to manage to exband enough to manage to employ at least one from each family in the village - if they behave good enough, so it become interesting for the whole village to let me in peace. Hoping they understand and agree it's important no one steal some mashine parts or such... :)

[i am bob]

So true Bob ..... I left management when I was told I could no longer treat employees as individuals but had to go strictly by the book .... if the book said hang'um that is what they wanted ...... so why hire a qualified experience manager .... a robot or college grad right out of school could do it ... and a lot cheaper .... if all you had to do was read it from a book and not from actual experience ..... if you could teach a monkey to read he could do it too ..... all he would have to do is open the book and say "sorry Jim ... it says here that making noise is a hanging offense ..... and as you were singing tomorrow we hang you" ..... (oh by the way I have heard some people singing here in the Phils that should be hung ... :mocking: ) :hystery: :hystery: :hystery:

Well, good morning boys and girls. I'm on my 2nd cup of coffee (with Kahlua of course) so I'm in a good mood (nasty)

to respond to Mike S'sss post.

Rereading the OP, I think there are couple issues being discussed here. One is enforcing store policy by strictly following

it to the letter. No warnings or grace period. The other issue is whether the PNP should have been involved. Let's start

with the PNP.....first question comes to mind -- is this teenager still in jail? And for what may I ask -- a bag of chips and

the poor (and still hungry) teenager is still in jail? Is by the book method apply a balance between punishment and crime?

I tend to agree with Kevin (Sonjack) that we have to put things in perspective. However, if you notice your inventory quickly

disappearing with no increase in sales over a period of time, perhaps another employee meeting with a final and more stern

warning. In many sari-sari stores-small businesses, often times the family members or relatives are stealing behind your back.

Additionally some Filipinos do not understand or maintain a balance sheet. The word budget is not in the Filipino mind set.

Some would rather eat the profits by chasing women, drinking spree, karaoke, majong and playing sabong.

One final note -- this Filipino can't sing to save his life and much more noticeable is that I'm not hung like a horse anymore.....

Dirty old goat -- Jake

I think the idea of not being able to budget is one of the biggest problems for many people in the Philippines. Especially when they first head out from the old homestead and on their own. This is something that schools should be tackling as I don't think all of the parents are able to teach this - for a number of reasons. Still, this doesn't make it right to blatantly break the rules at work. Nor is it right to lock someone up in jail for several days over it. There is so much wrong in so many different directions from every side on this one.

And, to further stir the pot, Jake, I don't think they hang horses... :rolleyes:

[Thomas]

The word budget is not in the Filipino mind set.

Yes. And planning ahead is uncommon too.

But to their defence it isn't much odd, because not much idea to make budgets, when most are so poor making they have hard to get some food for the DAY... :'(

[i am bob]

The word budget is not in the Filipino mind set.

Yes. And planning ahead is uncommon too.

But to their defence it isn't much odd, because not much idea to make budgets, when most are so poor making they have hard to get some food for the DAY... :'(

Exactly Thomas!

 

This is why I would like to see this handled as a class in school.  They could pop it into a math class or something.

[Thomas]

 

The word budget is not in the Filipino mind set.

Yes. And planning ahead is uncommon too.

But to their defence it isn't much odd, because not much idea to make budgets, when most are so poor making they have hard to get some food for the DAY... :'(

Exactly Thomas!

 

This is why I would like to see this handled as a class in school.  They could pop it into a math class or something.

Yes. But problem finding teachers  :)

(I have found a fee, but I doubt they want to be school teachers.)

[bootleultras]

We have had incidents of theft in our business (bar & grill) some food but mainly money though, the biggest amount being 6,000 pesos which i will never understand as the night before the same person couldve stolen 30,000.

Knowing it was this individual due to cctv amongst other things led me to fire them on the spot, I understand the hardships of people but I have no choice other than to set out a statement to other staff that this is unacceptable, none of the remaining staff are aware that I didnt inform the authorities or even ask for a penny of this back! For me knowing who I can trust and cannot is my priority, besides having these people locked up will achieve nothing in the long run and them losing their job and any chance of a character reference for future was gone.....most of my employees do have goals of working in bigger establishments either home or abroad & are well aware their performances will lead to a strong reference from my business on their behalf.

In other words I think Savemore were harsh in a way but setting a president in another.....I still wouldnt condone a jail sentence for this type of crime though when others get away with much less for worse crimes!

[i am bob]

We have had incidents of theft in our business (bar & grill) some food but mainly money though, the biggest amount being 6,000 pesos which i will never understand as the night before the same person couldve stolen 30,000.

Knowing it was this individual due to cctv amongst other things led me to fire them on the spot, I understand the hardships of people but I have no choice other than to set out a statement to other staff that this is unacceptable, none of the remaining staff are aware that I didnt inform the authorities or even ask for a penny of this back! For me knowing who I can trust and cannot is my priority, besides having these people locked up will achieve nothing in the long run and them losing their job and any chance of a character reference for future was gone.....most of my employees do have goals of working in bigger establishments either home or abroad & are well aware their performances will lead to a strong reference from my business on their behalf.

In other words I think Savemore were harsh in a way but setting a president in another.....I still wouldnt condone a jail sentence for this type of crime though when others get away with much less for worse crimes!

 

You have got it right!

 

Theft from a business can not be tolerated but there has to be some humanity in any punishment meted out.