Thomas Hunt

[Mr Lee]

Mark, I am sorry but there were no plans, and definitely not the best laid plans on his part.Mark, a fund should be set up to help people who helped themselves and did not get themselves into the mess they are in. He moved to the Philippines without setting up income for himself here. Very poor planning on his part. He left a woman in charge of a joint account that had already bankrupted him. Extremely poor planning, and now you want to bail him out because his wife will not pay his bills. I am sorry but he already knew who and what she was before he came back to the Philippines without her. Sometimes people get what they deserve IMHO. Think about it.We also cannot expect the US govt to bail him out because his wife is stealing his money, they are already paying him and it is not their fault that he left his wife in charge to steal his money and came back to the Philippines without her. If it was his choice to return to the Philippines without her, he should have taken his money with him or at the very least moved it out of her control.

Lee, I can not disagree with you. However neither you nor I know all the circumstances of their marriage or his move to CDO. But we can surmise. If all he had left, after his wife cleaned him out, was his $1000 pension then that would go considerably further here in the Philippines than in Yuma. He came here believing that his wife would join him once she had settled the matter of her Green Card. By leaving her in charge of the ATM card he was assuming the husband's responsibility of providing for his wife financially and, one presumes, he felt he could trust her to send him funds sufficient for his needs. It would appear that he no longer received funds from her once he was admitted to hospital.Mark

Mark, there is one simple answer to all this, why would she need a green card if she had agreed to move to CDO? The facts are simple, she would not have needed a green card at all and in fact, a green card would become invalid if she moved to CDO and stayed over 6 months out of the USA.......... I know that we do not know the answers to all the questions here, but I also know that people can never help people who get themselves in trouble because there would never be enough money in the whole world to help all the idiots out there........ While I am not calling him an idiot, the fact stands that he trusted her with funds after she bankrupted him in the first place, so I again ask this question, how did he expect to support himself in CDO if he did not take charge of his Social Security? Mark you asked me what I thought an expat fund should be for, and my answer is to help expats who get themselves into trouble.....So I think just like you on that but the way to help people is to pay for a phone call to relatives, or to feed someone until their next check comes in should there be a glitch in the system, but not to help people who come to the Philippines and put themselves into harms way......Should it be known that you do that, then you will find more and more idiots like the one on the other forum who move to the Philippines without money full well knowing there is a fund to bail their ass out......Where would you draw the line? Who would you help and who would you let sink? Sorry but while I feel for Mr. Hunt and his situation, I could not condone the use of a fund to pay his bills based on what we know the situation to be.

[Mik]

An individual needs to have personal responsibility. There is also family responsibility where they take care of their own. Help from friends, neighbors or the person's church is very limited so you can't count on that. And likewise never expect help from strangers - they have responsibility to their own families first.How can a person protect himself? Having access to money for emergencies is an obvious requirement. Live a simple lifestyle so you can build up your savings account. Do not go into debt for luxuries. If you can't pay cash for something you can't afford it. Have a high limit credit card for emergencies. Keep a $0 balance on it. Don't ever use it unless you have no other choice. Personally, if I am stricken with a terminal illness I would reject expensive treatment that would only prolong my life just a brief period of time. (When its time to go, its time to go.) But I would accept an expensive (but affordable) treatment that had a good chance of restoring my health. You have to watch out for yourself. If you don't care enough about yourself to do that, why should others care?

[Mr Lee]

You have to watch out for yourself. If you don't care enough about yourself to do that, why should others care?

Exactly!

[Markham]

Mark you asked me what I thought an expat fund should be for, and my answer is to help expats who get themselves into trouble.....So I think just like you on that but the way to help people is to pay for a phone call to relatives, or to feed someone until their next check comes in should there be a glitch in the system, but not to help people who come to the Philippines and put themselves into harms way......Should it be known that you do that, then you will find more and more idiots like the one on the other forum who move to the Philippines without money full well knowing there is a fund to bail their a** out......Where would you draw the line? Who would you help and who would you let sink? Sorry but while I feel for Mr. Hunt and his situation, I could not condone the use of a fund to pay his bills based on what we know the situation to be.

Perhaps you are right about the Hunt case. However, assume for a moment that you are a Board member of the Expat's Fund and you get a phone call from (say) Daisy to tell you that an unknown and unconscious American has just been admitted to an Emergency Room in Cagayan. His wallet contains 250 Pesos. The hospital wants 5000 Pesos before they start treatment. Are you going to agree to this payment? The clock is ticking, what's your decision?It's a moral dilemma, Lee, and one that the Fund's Board Members are going to face; possibly each and every time.Some cases will be fairly cut and dried. The Walter Mitty character on the other forum is an obvious case where a claim on the Expats' Fund would be turned-down - although, I'd probably endorse a claim to pay the $50-odd cost of rebooking his flight back to Seattle!But his is, perhaps, an unusual case: we know his "history" and we know that he was advised to wait until he had sufficient funds for all his needs before coming here. With other claimants, we may not have that luxury of knowledge and probably not enough - or no - time to investigate the background. A decision whether or not to provide help has to be given quickly.Mark

[Jollygoodfellow]

Mark you asked me what I thought an expat fund should be for, and my answer is to help expats who get themselves into trouble.....So I think just like you on that but the way to help people is to pay for a phone call to relatives, or to feed someone until their next check comes in should there be a glitch in the system, but not to help people who come to the Philippines and put themselves into harms way......Should it be known that you do that, then you will find more and more idiots like the one on the other forum who move to the Philippines without money full well knowing there is a fund to bail their a** out......Where would you draw the line? Who would you help and who would you let sink? Sorry but while I feel for Mr. Hunt and his situation, I could not condone the use of a fund to pay his bills based on what we know the situation to be.

Perhaps you are right about the Hunt case. However, assume for a moment that you are a Board member of the Expat's Fund and you get a phone call from (say) Daisy to tell you that an unknown and unconscious American has just been admitted to an Emergency Room in Cagayan. His wallet contains 250 Pesos. The hospital wants 5000 Pesos before they start treatment. Are you going to agree to this payment? The clock is ticking, what's your decision?It's a moral dilemma, Lee, and one that the Fund's Board Members are going to face; possibly each and every time.Some cases will be fairly cut and dried. The Walter Mitty character on the other forum is an obvious case where a claim on the Expats' Fund would be turned-down - although, I'd probably endorse a claim to pay the $50-odd cost of rebooking his flight back to Seattle!But his is, perhaps, an unusual case: we know his "history" and we know that he was advised to wait until he had sufficient funds for all his needs before coming here. With other claimants, we may not have that luxury of knowledge and probably not enough - or no - time to investigate the background. A decision whether or not to provide help has to be given quickly.Mark

Moral dilemma #2Filipino man arrives at hospital in critical condition, hospital want money,wife of Filipino hears of expat fund and pleads for help,Filipino refused help because not an expat.Man dies,wife and six kids starve on street.No, we cant save the world, but why is an expat more important,usually an expat who cant pay his way is either hiding from the law, a misfit bum,should never left their home country,have no friends or relatives and a personality disorder.What would happen to the "Walter Mitty" case person if he needed urgent genuine hospital treatment? turned down because he was advised not to come to the Philippines?

[Markham]

Moral dilemma #2Filipino man arrives at hospital in critical condition, hospital want money,wife of Filipino hears of expat fund and pleads for help,Filipino refused help because not an expat.Man dies,wife and six kids starve on street.

Fair point, Tom. However Daisy Cline is the Chair of the Expats' Ladies' Charities (based in Cagayan De Oro) to whom such a case might be referred.

No, we cant save the world, but why is an expat more important,usually an expat who cant pay his way is either hiding from the law, a misfit bum,should never left their home country,have no friends or relatives and a personality disorder.

I'm not saying an Expat is more important than a Filipino - far from it. However a Filipino will, 9 times out of 10, have family who can come to his assistance and there are a number of Church and non-sectarian organisations that can be approached. An Expat may not enjoy that additional layer of security.

What would happen to the "Walter Mitty" case person if he needed urgent genuine hospital treatment? turned down because he was advised not to come to the Philippines?

If you read the comments, particularly in the "Expats' Mutual Assistance Fund" thread on that other site, you'll see that there'd be stiff resistence to helping him.