Good Idea... But For The Wrong Reasons.

[Bruce]

Another example of not caring about the local results as long as it 'appears' that Phils is doing the right thing. The first two paragraphs says it all. Not any effort at all to hide their true agenda. It is all about chasing the money that the US represents. Puppet strings.   

 

Off manilastandardtoday .com (not a hot link)

 

 

 

PH seen clearing US blacklist

By Joyce Pangco Panares | Posted on Feb. 14, 2013 at 12:01am |

 

 

President Aquino has signed into law the Expanded Anti-Trafficking Act which the government hopes would boost the chances of the country in getting an upgrade in the US State Department’s human trafficking list.

“We hope that with this expanded coverage of anti-trafficking, we will be able to remove ourselves from Tier 2. This is a concern and a priority of our President and this measure will be enforced by the different agencies especially the Department of Justice as well as our police agencies,” presidential spokesman Edwin Lacierda said.

The country was removed from the Tier 2 watchlist in 2011 but was kept at Tier 2 in the US State Department report last year.

Republic Act No. 10364, signed on Feb. 6, included a provision directing the Philippine Overseas Employment Administration to create a blacklist of recruitment agencies, illegal recruiters and persons facing administrative, civil and criminal complaints for trafficking.

The blacklist would be posted in conspicuous places in  government agencies and shall be updated monthly.

Senator Loren Legarda, principal author of the measure, said the new law would provide added protection not just for victims of trafficking “but also, to a reasonable extent, law enforcement officers and social workers from harassment suits for lawful acts done in good faith during authorized rescue operations, investigation or prosecution of a case.”

The new law fills the void  in the existing law by expanding the list of acts that promote trafficking, to include an act to destroy or tamper with evidence, to influence witnesses in an investigation, or to utilize one’s public office to impede an investigation or to obstruct the execution of lawful orders,” Legarda added.

The new law establishes free legal assistance to overseas Filipino workers by the Department of Foreign Affairs in coordination with the Department of Labor and Employment, which will be in charge of providing temporary shelter to Filipino victims of trafficking overseas.
 

[softail]

I guess I'm not sure what the problem is. What's the problem with a country trying to improve its image a little and help some people at the
same time?  Perhaps reading something into this that isn't there.  JMHO :rolleyes: 

 

Doug

 

[Bruce]

I guess I'm not sure what the problem is. What's the problem with a country trying to improve its image a little and help some people at the

same time?  Perhaps reading something into this that isn't there.  JMHO :rolleyes: 

 

Doug

 

 

The problem is that 'true' sex trafficing is not all that great in volume. The 'answer' to that is to, as stated in this article and others, was to 'expand' the defination. And to continue to expand it until you have 'sufficent numbers' to prove your point.

 

Here in the US, tax papers are due on April 15th. You mail on April 15 but there is an issue at the post office and some machine breaks and your papers are post marked the 16th. Not a huge issue. Today. But using the logic of this new law, the expanded law, if the US government followed this by expanding the defination of 'tax cheats' and your tax papers are 1 day late, YOU, under the new law are now a 'tax cheat' and owe a big fine. Now, are you really a tax cheat? Or was the law expanded to throw a wider net to get more fine money?

 

I pay the school fees for multiple kids. Most are kids I have never even met. But under the law, and if it expands again, even wider... at what time will 'someone' in the 'task force' start to think WHY would some Kano pay school fees for kids? That is very strange, maybe he is a sex trafficer! Maybe he is paying the school fees to bribe the families??? And the human imagination runs wild with WHY, some Kano wants to help squatters????

 

Chasing true kidnappers and sex trafficers of kids is one thing. But, the numbers are 'just not there' to justify the expense and publicity. So again, the law is expanded to generate, on paper, more victims, and therfore, more criminals.

 

Another problem is that by 'taking away' prostitution jobs, and NOT offering comparable paying jobs for those same women, the families suffer.

 

While prostitution may not be the 1st job of choice, the job of prostitution DOES support entire families and send kids to school and pay medical bills in addition to simply buying rice.

 

A legit governmental role in protecting kids from exploitation has been morphed into a huge governmental business, not to help people, but also as stated in the article... to simply meet a imaginary goal to 'appease' the US and get Phils off some damn list! And lets not forget the GRANT MONEY from the US.  

 

This forum has a history of posts complaining about this same issue and the damage it does on the local level to families.

 

Now, as stated in this article, the law will now protect 'witch hunts' by not allowing people falsely accused to sue. As many are aware in Phils, the level of training and education for law enforcement varies greatly. Now, under the new law, you can be charged by the local yahoo with a bribe in mind, you fail to pay the bribe and suddenly you are in jail and have no recourse. Even after you prove that it was some other guy or no guy at all , no crime was committed, you can not 'bring a case' or even perhaps complain about your arrest IF the officer says he / she was 'acting in good faith'. The term 'checks and balances' is not found in the Phils legal system. A system where even though a hotel camera tapes a Brit checking into a hotel (in Cebu) at the same time a girl was kidnapped across town. Not only was he charged, but the prosecutor was arguing that the camera evidence is 'alibi evidence' and therefore not admissible, Keep in mind here, the prosecutor was NOT arguing that the camera evidence was not accurate or fake, but under Phils law, simply was not admissible! So the prosecutor KNEW the charge was false and the Brit arrested was NOT the guy who kidnapped the girl, he still tried to prosecute the Brit.

 

So a simple concept of protecting kids... has now become a money making venture with the US paying huge amounts of money to Phils for chasing down sex trafficers... but.... not enough arrests to make Uncle Sam happy. What to do... oh what to do??? Why... rework the law to artificially create more victims and then more sex trafficers!

 

 

For those members in Manila and AC, there have been some press about club raids and phantom charges and bribes paid and money paid to families to send their daughter in looking for a job, with the police 2 min behind...

 

It is all about the money. Never forget that. Simple math. No victims = No money. Low victim count = low criminal count = little money. Redefine the law to create more victims = more criminals = more police jobs = more US grant money. All about the money. Nothing about collateral damage because  the oldest daughter 'was rescued' from her internet boy friend who was sending money to pay the younger kids school  fees...

 

You guys did see the internet part in the new law? Right? You DO understand that it may be YOU the law is looking at now? At what point will Phils work a deal with other countries to track back the internet connections so that you (yes YOU) who are chatting online with your 32 yr old GF get  KNOCK on your door at your flat in Leeds -on Thames- In Sherwood Forest and there are the police wanting to examine your computer.

 

But but but the law is for protecting the kids! Right?? Noooo, it has been expanded to stop people like you from 'exploiting' those poor women in any 3rd world country. It has been ILLEGAL now for a few years to do internet dating in Phils. Did you know that? This is why Tom, His Jollyness, refuses to participate in any internet dating heading or forum category. Because Tom knows under Phils law, it is illegal. So he does not do it! Tom is smart. Tom could make money by hosting a dating site. But NOT WORTH THE RISK.. so he doesn't.

 

But if YOU belong to another site for dating and if the government decided to change the law to make it illegal even if the company is based in another country other than Phils.... when YOU arrive to meet your wonderful woman, due to computers, you may be tracked and met at the airport... all in the name of PROTECTION for the poor kids (and now others) in the Philippines.

 

Some of you might think I am on a rant... but then in looking at the effort Phils is putting into appeasing the US and getting grant money...... and then amending the law to protect police from false arrests..... I see nothing good here but an open chase for money.  The original idea of stopping sex trafficing is a geat idea. But once it became a 'business' instead of purpose, and huge amounts of money began coming into the country to fight the sex trafficing industry(!).... then individual rights and recourse were ended. 

Edited February 14, 2013 by Bruce

[JJReyes]

I recall reading an article by an advocacy group stating that, "1-in-4 children in America are subjected to sexual assault." It got my attention because of the number and what it implied. A follow-up by a news reporter found that the group has a very broad definition. They considered a child seeing the body of adult who was not an immediate family member as sexual assault. That would include seeing a person changing clothes at a beach or an adult of the same sex in a public toilet. The advocacy group wanted funding for their cause.

 

I agree with Bruce that some laws are meant to improve an image or generate income through grants. The paperwork will include data such as how many women were "saved" even if they were reluctant about getting rescued. There have been previous posts on this.

Edited February 15, 2013 by JJReyes

[i am bob]

I guess I'm not sure what the problem is. What's the problem with a country trying to improve its image a little and help some people at the

same time?  Perhaps reading something into this that isn't there.  JMHO :rolleyes: 

 

Doug

 

 

The problem is that 'true' sex trafficing is not all that great in volume. The 'answer' to that is to, as stated in this article and others, was to 'expand' the defination. And to continue to expand it until you have 'sufficent numbers' to prove your point.

 

Here in the US, tax papers are due on April 15th. You mail on April 15 but there is an issue at the post office and some machine breaks and your papers are post marked the 16th. Not a huge issue. Today. But using the logic of this new law, the expanded law, if the US government followed this by expanding the defination of 'tax cheats' and your tax papers are 1 day late, YOU, under the new law are now a 'tax cheat' and owe a big fine. Now, are you really a tax cheat? Or was the law expanded to throw a wider net to get more fine money?

 

I pay the school fees for multiple kids. Most are kids I have never even met. But under the law, and if it expands again, even wider... at what time will 'someone' in the 'task force' start to think WHY would some Kano pay school fees for kids? That is very strange, maybe he is a sex trafficer! Maybe he is paying the school fees to bribe the families??? And the human imagination runs wild with WHY, some Kano wants to help squatters????

 

Chasing true kidnappers and sex trafficers of kids is one thing. But, the numbers are 'just not there' to justify the expense and publicity. So again, the law is expanded to generate, on paper, more victims, and therfore, more criminals.

 

Another problem is that by 'taking away' prostitution jobs, and NOT offering comparable paying jobs for those same women, the families suffer.

 

While prostitution may not be the 1st job of choice, the job of prostitution DOES support entire families and send kids to school and pay medical bills in addition to simply buying rice.

 

A legit governmental role in protecting kids from exploitation has been morphed into a huge governmental business, not to help people, but also as stated in the article... to simply meet a imaginary goal to 'appease' the US and get Phils off some damn list! And lets not forget the GRANT MONEY from the US.  

 

This forum has a history of posts complaining about this same issue and the damage it does on the local level to families.

 

Now, as stated in this article, the law will now protect 'witch hunts' by not allowing people falsely accused to sue. As many are aware in Phils, the level of training and education for law enforcement varies greatly. Now, under the new law, you can be charged by the local yahoo with a bribe in mind, you fail to pay the bribe and suddenly you are in jail and have no recourse. Even after you prove that it was some other guy or no guy at all , no crime was committed, you can not 'bring a case' or even perhaps complain about your arrest IF the officer says he / she was 'acting in good faith'. The term 'checks and balances' is not found in the Phils legal system. A system where even though a hotel camera tapes a Brit checking into a hotel (in Cebu) at the same time a girl was kidnapped across town. Not only was he charged, but the prosecutor was arguing that the camera evidence is 'alibi evidence' and therefore not admissible, Keep in mind here, the prosecutor was NOT arguing that the camera evidence was not accurate or fake, but under Phils law, simply was not admissible! So the prosecutor KNEW the charge was false and the Brit arrested was NOT the guy who kidnapped the girl, he still tried to prosecute the Brit.

 

So a simple concept of protecting kids... has now become a money making venture with the US paying huge amounts of money to Phils for chasing down sex trafficers... but.... not enough arrests to make Uncle Sam happy. What to do... oh what to do??? Why... rework the law to artificially create more victims and then more sex trafficers!

 

 

For those members in Manila and AC, there have been some press about club raids and phantom charges and bribes paid and money paid to families to send their daughter in looking for a job, with the police 2 min behind...

 

It is all about the money. Never forget that. Simple math. No victims = No money. Low victim count = low criminal count = little money. Redefine the law to create more victims = more criminals = more police jobs = more US grant money. All about the money. Nothing about collateral damage because  the oldest daughter 'was rescued' from her internet boy friend who was sending money to pay the younger kids school  fees...

 

You guys did see the internet part in the new law? Right? You DO understand that it may be YOU the law is looking at now? At what point will Phils work a deal with other countries to track back the internet connections so that you (yes YOU) who are chatting online with your 32 yr old GF get  KNOCK on your door at your flat in Leeds -on Thames- In Sherwood Forest and there are the police wanting to examine your computer.

 

But but but the law is for protecting the kids! Right?? Noooo, it has been expanded to stop people like you from 'exploiting' those poor women in any 3rd world country. It has been ILLEGAL now for a few years to do internet dating in Phils. Did you know that? This is why Tom, His Jollyness, refuses to participate in any internet dating heading or forum category. Because Tom knows under Phils law, it is illegal. So he does not do it! Tom is smart. Tom could make money by hosting a dating site. But NOT WORTH THE RISK.. so he doesn't.

 

But if YOU belong to another site for dating and if the government decided to change the law to make it illegal even if the company is based in another country other than Phils.... when YOU arrive to meet your wonderful woman, due to computers, you may be tracked and met at the airport... all in the name of PROTECTION for the poor kids (and now others) in the Philippines.

 

Some of you might think I am on a rant... but then in looking at the effort Phils is putting into appeasing the US and getting grant money...... and then amending the law to protect police from false arrests..... I see nothing good here but an open chase for money.  The original idea of stopping sex trafficing is a geat idea. But once it became a 'business' instead of purpose, and huge amounts of money began coming into the country to fight the sex trafficing industry(!).... then individual rights and recourse were ended. 

 

The whole point in the law is to protect the people who need protecting the most.  The first group is the OFW.  Some of these so-called "employment agencies" are illegally hiring Filipinos as OFWs without them being properly cleared and with the proper paperwork.  Why?  Because they are sending them to countries that are black-listed as countries for OFWs to go to...  Very low pay...  Being charged room and board almost as high as their pay.  Having them sign contracts that they can't leave until after they have paid back the costs of the OFWs getting to the place of employment - which somehow takes an extremely long time to pay back.  Sometimes they end up in countries where they have no rights - don't want to pay your worker?  Have them thrown in jail.  This is what the law is to prevent.  And, yes, child labour and prostitution fall under the same group - many are being set up to go to other countries where they will have a very hard time trying to get home again IF they aren't killed along the way.  Once again it is starting with these so-called "employment agencies" and "employment agents".  And these are the people the government wants to go after with these laws.

 

The first thing they are doing to stop this is by creating a black list of these companies that are have been caught doing the things I listed above and more.  They are also listing the people who were running these companies - the main people who were basically selling their fellow Filipinos into slavery.  Now, somebody wants to know about the company offering them a job as an OFW?  They can check to make sure they aren't dealing with these people.

 

Another part of the article stated the following: "new law would provide added protection not just for victims of trafficking “but also, to a reasonable extent, law enforcement officers and social workers from harassment suits for lawful acts done in good faith during authorized rescue operations, investigation or prosecution of a case.”  They are not talking about just grabbing somebody off the street for no good reason.  Note the author stated this would add protection to "a reasonable extent" for law enforcement and social workers from harassment suits.  This has been the current method of getting everything thrown out of court...  Multiple harassment suits are filed against the police officers and social workers to get them to drop the charges.  So what would keep them coming after you?  Go back to the quote again - "during authorized rescue operations, investigation or prosecution of a case."  We aren't talking just a police officer deciding he doesn't like the way you look...  Or even the entire police department doesn't like you.  To be authorized, we are talking multiple departments including the Department of Justice, BI, Department of Labour and Employment / Bureau of Women and Young Workers, DILG, POEA and PNP being involved in setting up and carrying out the investigation.

 

The article spoke of certain holes being filled.  You gotta admit that these holes needed to be filled in order for the law and court systems to work the way they are suppose to.  Why not pay off a policeman to get rid of the evidence?  Threaten the witnesses so that they leave town and hide?  Find out that a bust is on it's way?  Get your local protection (gang members, police you have bought and paid for, same for military members, etc) to block the police from getting to your establishment of ill repute.  These and many more are the things that are being stopped from happening any more.  To me?  This is just good government and establishing a legal basis to ensure corruption is stopped in it's tracks and the court system is allowed to function the way it is suppose to.

 

This whole issue is in order to have the Philippines recognized as fully Tier II compliant.  Yes, the Philippines was elevated and removed from the Tier II list already - but the US decided to take matters in their own hands and not recognize this promotion.  This further effort will ensure even the US has to recognise their progression.  Because coming off the Tier II will open the Philippines up to a lot more on the International level.

 

I myself applaud this new law.  Every chance and option that the government can come up with to ensure better government and stopping corruption, I will stand again and applaud.  

[Call me bubba]

The first thing they are doing to stop this is by creating a black list of these companies that are have been caught doing the things I listed above and more. They are also listing the people who were running these companies - the main people who were basically selling their fellow Filipinos into slavery. Now, somebody wants to know about the company offering them a job as an OFW? They can check to make sure they aren't dealing with these people.

 

why in the h x ll has it taken all these years to do something so simple so easy?

 i recall that supposedly that a "black"list already exists but was never used or implemented

if somehow they could name the owners/shareholders of these 'firms" and prohibit/banned from

ever working in this line of work, then thats a good start.  

 

Bruce what you have written is a great post  :th_thbestpost:

[MikeB]

The whole point in the law is to protect the people who need protecting the most.  The first group is the OFW.  Some of these so-called "employment agencies" are illegally hiring Filipinos as OFWs without them being properly cleared and with the proper paperwork.  Why?  Because they are sending them to countries that are black-listed as countries for OFWs to go to...  Very low pay...

I don't believe that is true; there are 41 blacklisted countries, several eg, Afghanistan, are blacklisted because they are in active combat, almost all the others are very small countries, a number in the Caribbean, where there is little or no demand for foreign workers from the Philippines. The head of the Overseas Workers Welfare Administration has said that the blacklist has very little affect on OFW placement. The biggest threat most of these people face is from their own unscrupulous agencies.

[i am bob]

The whole point in the law is to protect the people who need protecting the most.  The first group is the OFW.  Some of these so-called "employment agencies" are illegally hiring Filipinos as OFWs without them being properly cleared and with the proper paperwork.  Why?  Because they are sending them to countries that are black-listed as countries for OFWs to go to...  Very low pay...

I don't believe that is true; there are 41 blacklisted countries, several eg, Afghanistan, are blacklisted because they are in active combat, almost all the others are very small countries, a number in the Caribbean, where there is little or no demand for foreign workers from the Philippines. The head of the Overseas Workers Welfare Administration has said that the blacklist has very little affect on OFW placement. The biggest threat most of these people face is from their own unscrupulous agencies.

I think you may have misread what I wrote.  The blacklisted countries were just the first of the many issues I pointed out - including the employment agencies.  

[i am bob]

The first thing they are doing to stop this is by creating a black list of these companies that are have been caught doing the things I listed above and more. They are also listing the people who were running these companies - the main people who were basically selling their fellow Filipinos into slavery. Now, somebody wants to know about the company offering them a job as an OFW? They can check to make sure they aren't dealing with these people.

 

why in the h x ll has it taken all these years to do something so simple so easy?

 i recall that supposedly that a "black"list already exists but was never used or implemented

if somehow they could name the owners/shareholders of these 'firms" and prohibit/banned from

ever working in this line of work, then thats a good start.  

 

Bruce what you have written is a great post  :th_thbestpost:

For years it was possible to buy your way in and run a business like this without repercussion   That has gone by the wayside now and the government is trying to close up the loopholes to ensure that it doesn't happen any more.  The black-listed countries were easy enough to see before but now you can also see all the so-called employment agencies as well as the unethical agents who have been caught and blacklisted as well.

[JJReyes]

The whole point in the law is to protect the people who need protecting the most.

 

I agree with this, but sometimes there are unintended consequences. Canadian families were hiring caregivers from the Phiippines and other countries to help care for their young children as nannies or for older parents. The rules were fairly lax and they were more or less private arrangements between families and caregivers with placement agencies as intermediaries. Then there were highly publicized abuse cases. Although few in numbers, the do-gooders went wild over the exploitation of women. For example, they were not given day-offs. The Filipina woment were treated like "slaves" forced to work twelve hours a day for under minimum wage.

 

Rules were tightened. A new bureaucracy was created. Families now had to pay the minimum wage of the province, pay overtime, give the caregivers day offs, etc. The unintended consequence is the families could no longer afford caregivers. The number of new hires plummented.

 

Using the cruise industry as a parallel example, the contracts are ten months; twelve hours a day; no day-offs during the contract period. You are given cramped quarters in the bottom of the ship; three meals and snacks; uniforms you had to wash and iron during your off hours; and by US standards, a lousy wage. Filipinos and other nationals fight to get jobs on cruise liners. Why agree to these working conditions? The reason is wages are five to ten times better than at home and the working conditions at home are worse.

 

The do-gooders in Canada won at the expense of those whom they were trying to protect against exploitation. (I still like the Canadians.)

Edited February 15, 2013 by JJReyes