Buying land

[sonjack2847]

2 hours ago, Reboot said:

There's a way to own land free and clear as a foreigner. First you perform some incredible act of service on behalf of the nation. Heroic even. Driving the Chinese off one of those islands single handed might qualify. Then get to be best friends forever with Manny Pacquiao and have him help get their congress to recognize you and grant you honorary citizenship. After that, you can buy all the land you like. 

Easy.

Now why didn`t I think of that.

[Dave Hounddriver]

2 hours ago, Snowy79 said:

 

I'm  fresh out of a meeting with a senior lawyer that specialises in land registration and real estate.

 

You show me a lawyer who says he can set up an unbreakable trust so a foreigner can own land here, (when and if a Philippine citizen has a legitimate objection), and I'll show you a lawyer who says he will force the sale of the property with the money going 30% to the lawyer, some court costs from the sale price, and the balance to the Philippine citizen with the legitimate objection.  It may be a toss up who will win but I will say this.  YOUR lawyer will want cash up front to do this.  The filipino's lawyer will do it on contingency, which means if they do not win they do not get paid.

I know what my gut tells me about that 

I am not suggesting "don't do it" and you will find the members on this forum don't go to the other members when the shite hits the fan and say "We told you so".  But those of us who have been around have seen many of our members and ourselves try to "beat the system" and lose.  Its just a darn shame that most of the laws in this country are not "foreigner friendly".  This goes for so many things in the Philippines, not just property transactions.

So as I said, I am not suggesting "don't do it" but I am suggesting not to promote it on the forum as some way to beat the system.  I was gullible when I arrived.  Many new people are.  When a forum member talked like he had a "sure thing" then others (like me back then) tended to follow suit and if/when it does not work then there are more people than you who will need new shirts.

[AlwaysRt]

35 minutes ago, Dave Hounddriver said:

You show me a lawyer who says he can set up an unbreakable trust so a foreigner can own land here, (when and if a Philippine citizen has a legitimate objection), and I'll show you a lawyer who says he will force the sale of the property with the money going 30% to the lawyer, some court costs from the sale price, and the balance to the Philippine citizen with the legitimate objection.  It may be a toss up who will win but I will say this.  YOUR lawyer will want cash up front to do this.  The filipino's lawyer will do it on contingency, which means if they do not win they do not get paid.

I know what my gut tells me about that 

I am not suggesting "don't do it" and you will find the members on this forum don't go to the other members when the shite hits the fan and say "We told you so".  But those of us who have been around have seen many of our members and ourselves try to "beat the system" and lose.  Its just a darn shame that most of the laws in this country are not "foreigner friendly".  This goes for so many things in the Philippines, not just property transactions.

So as I said, I am not suggesting "don't do it" but I am suggesting not to promote it on the forum as some way to beat the system.  I was gullible when I arrived.  Many new people are.  When a forum member talked like he had a "sure thing" then others (like me back then) tended to follow suit and if/when it does not work then there are more people than you who will need new shirts.

I agree, the tactic would stand up to about 5 minutes of scrutiny before being determined an obvious attempt to circumvent Philippine property law. Will work great - until it doesn't. (nope, I am not a lawyer and this isn't official. I do read and know people and have dealt with the Philippine system enough to have an idea how it operates though.)

[Snowy79]

There's no foreign land owning involved. He made it 100% clear that land can't be held by a foreigner unless through a PEZA and again only under some exempt businesses. He also made it 100% clear that in 50yrs unless the law is changed the lease is cancelled and the land goes to the Filipino share holder by which time I'll be pushing up the daises anyway. Any selling of the land or cancelling of the lease without adequate compensation is protected if annotated on page two of the land title.

We will be having a legitimate business as laid down by the government and comply with every rule and regulation. I'm sure there's a few people that get caught out and I'd hedge a bet the things they were caught out on stick out like a sore thumb. Life is a gamble to an extent and we can only minimise the risks. I'm sure if the government clamped down on foreign companies using land they would have to work flat out for the next 100yrs just to investigate them and then another 100 years worth of court days etc.

This lawyer has been acting on behalf of my friends companies for the best part of 30yrs and to-date has kept him on the straight and narrow. I'm not saying it's without it's issues but before anything is signed I'll make sure the chances of it going pear shaped is inline with someone holding a gun to my head and emptying my bank account. In fact I'd safely say there's been more foreigners screwed over by their wives than the government.

[Dave Hounddriver]

4 hours ago, Snowy79 said:

In fact I'd safely say there's been more foreigners screwed over by their wives than the government.

Yes.  I could imagine that.  But there are business owners, lawyers, relatives, appraisers, surveyors and agents to consider too.  Any of them can and do screw over foreigners.  Not to mention the worst ones. other foreigners screwing you over.

Bottom line is you have done everything you can to secure yourself in this situation.  What you are suggesting is commonly done.  For example, when Hilton Hotel forms a corporation to buy/lease land so they can build a hotel they do similar to what you have done.  It often works (Although the Radisson Hotel at SM mall Cebu is a case where it does not always work and Hilton ended up selling out to Movenpick so we are not sure how it worked for them).  The first rule of Philippine courts is Your Mileage May Vary.

So I like the way you have researched your project and I sincerely hope it works for you.  But if 10 others do it I'll put money on at least one of those deals screwing up during the 50 years.  As you said:

4 hours ago, Snowy79 said:

Life is a gamble to an extent and we can only minimise the risks.

I have been a lucky gambler in many ways when it comes to Philippine idiosyncrasies.  May you be as lucky.

[Gary D]

There is a sure fire way of owning land in the Philippines as a foriegner and it's all set out in the Philippine family code. First off you have to marry a Philippine citizen, then by the Philippine family code you and your spouse are treated as a single entity, hence any land and property you buy would be conjugal property and as such you are fully an equal owner of that property. Better still buy a vacant lot and build new, keep all of the receipts for the house which you can own solely.

Then everything will be hunky dory...... until she blows you out. 

[Old55]

2 hours ago, Gary D said:

There is a sure fire way of owning land in the Philippines as a foriegner and it's all set out in the Philippine family code. First off you have to marry a Philippine citizen, then by the Philippine family code you and your spouse are treated as a single entity, hence any land and property you buy would be conjugal property and as such you are fully an equal owner of that property. Better still buy a vacant lot and build new, keep all of the receipts for the house which you can own solely.

Then everything will be hunky dory...... until she blows you out. 

This is not entirely true, respectfully not to call you out but we should be very clear here. The words used are more or less correct but in fact a Foriegner can own a condominium under specific circumstances but ownership of real estate is never a sure thing 

[Snowy79]

8 hours ago, Gary D said:

There is a sure fire way of owning land in the Philippines as a foriegner and it's all set out in the Philippine family code. First off you have to marry a Philippine citizen, then by the Philippine family code you and your spouse are treated as a single entity, hence any land and property you buy would be conjugal property and as such you are fully an equal owner of that property. Better still buy a vacant lot and build new, keep all of the receipts for the house which you can own solely.

Then everything will be hunky dory...... until she blows you out. 

I've not looked fully into it as I've no intention of getting married but I've heard that if you've struck lucky and married a good one then she pops her clogs the inheritance laws them kick in which doesn't favour the foreigner.

[Dave Hounddriver]

44 minutes ago, Snowy79 said:

I've heard that if you've struck lucky and married a good one then she pops her clogs the inheritance laws them kick in which doesn't favour the foreigner.

There is some truth in that and its got me thinking of looking for a wife on the terminal cancer ward of the hospital, paying for her palliative care, and buying her a house.  Be sure she has no kids though.    (I mean as long as we are looking at long shots we may as well consider this one  )

[AlwaysRt]

37 minutes ago, Dave Hounddriver said:

There is some truth in that and its got me thinking of looking for a wife on the terminal cancer ward of the hospital, paying for her palliative care, and buying her a house.  Be sure she has no kids though.    (I mean as long as we are looking at long shots we may as well consider this one  )

Better make sure no parents, no siblings, and no whatever other way the crazy hereditary laws spider around everywhere.