Buying land

[i am bob]

I have been taking to a lawyer about leasing land recently.  This lawyer was recommended to me by the law firm who represents some of the family of a guy named Rody who travels a lot between Davao and Manila a lot for some senior government job he got stuck with...  (Du something or other..  hehe!). Anyway, long term leases are possible but make sure your lawyer thoroughly researches the property.  Hiring a second lawyer from a good firm to do another search will make sure it's as clean as you can get.  Find a piece of land you would purchase if you could and have your lawyer approach the seller if they would take a lease for the same amount you would offer if purchasing the property.  Do the lease in your name only with first options to purchase by your heirs upon your death or expiration of the lease.  Purchase price at the later time of purchase will be P100.  Register the lease and have it attached to the deed.  (Some places in the Philippines will differ on that last point - your lawyer will know which way to go).  Now I know someone will say that someone will come out with a claim to the property and steal it from you.  Each province is apparently different in how to apply this but it will be in the lease that, should someone else come forward, they are to receive any compensation for the property through the money already paid towards the lease before any other compensation is awarded.  Once they do that?  They've accepted their buyout from the one you leased from and aren't entitled to anything else.  Kind of guarantees the guy you're buying from won't want any other claimants bothering you do it's further insurance that the title is clean.  Also, don't forget to have included in the lease that any improvements carried out by you will be returned to you peso for peso should someone try to jump your claim.  There are a million different things that can be done to protect your lease.  These are just a few of them.  Really what you need is a good lawyer that won't rip you off...  It took me a while to find one here...  So why are my fiancee and I looking at moving north?  

[Dave Hounddriver]

8 minutes ago, i am bob said:

I have been taking to a lawyer about leasing land recently.

The following is my standard opinion/response whenever someone opens their post in this manner 

I would suggest that many (most) people who are buying/leasing land here have also talked to a lawyer.  Wise choice.  Some have even talked to retired judges to see what their opinion is.  What really makes me smile is that many of the opinions are different but each person thinks that the lawyer 'they' talked to has given the best advice.  In another post I mentioned a lawyer who was reputed (with good reason) to be the best lawyer in the province.  He still screwed over some foreigner in a land deal and got a whole year disbarment for doing that.

So best of luck to you and anyone else who thinks their lawyer is the solution to buying/leasing land here.  Of course you should use one.  Of course some are better than others.  Of course some methods have better success than others.  But always remember foreigners are not meant to own land here or use any means to circumvent that law and anyone, lawyer or otherwise, who tells you different is just giving you an opinion on how to beat the system which is not meant to be beat.  Kind of like people who have a system to win at blackjack.  Any legal method just does not work but there are always ways 

[i am bob]

15 minutes ago, Dave Hounddriver said:

The following is my standard opinion/response whenever someone opens their post in this manner 

I would suggest that many (most) people who are buying/leasing land here have also talked to a lawyer.  Wise choice.  Some have even talked to retired judges to see what their opinion is.  What really makes me smile is that many of the opinions are different but each person thinks that the lawyer 'they' talked to has given the best advice.  In another post I mentioned a lawyer who was reputed (with good reason) to be the best lawyer in the province.  He still screwed over some foreigner in a land deal and got a whole year disbarment for doing that.

So best of luck to you and anyone else who thinks their lawyer is the solution to buying/leasing land here.  Of course you should use one.  Of course some are better than others.  Of course some methods have better success than others.  But always remember foreigners are not meant to own land here or use any means to circumvent that law and anyone, lawyer or otherwise, who tells you different is just giving you an opinion on how to beat the system which is not meant to be beat.  Kind of like people who have a system to win at blackjack.  Any legal method just does not work but there are always ways 

Ah, but Dave, I'm not talking about buying the land but how to lease the land with the most protection that's available and fully compliant with all laws. That's why I went to a very reputable law firm who did not do in real estate to see who they would recommend.  It was their reputation on the line in this case.   I also discussed an easy method to see if the lawyer retained was being upfront and honest in the dealings.  If course, as with everything in the Philippines, there is always the chance that we may come out the loser.  But, if we are afraid to step up, hire the best we can to protect our interests and do the things to ensure we are protected to the best of our abilities, why even bother coming here in the first place.

[Gary D]

The magic word in all of this is control. If your lease as a foreigner is giving you control over that land it is illegal, end of.

[Gerald Glatt]

Hey Bob were you in hiding in the Yukon....

 

Glad your getting a place, I had been wondering about the 25-25 with a purchase option to get it to the wives family after we two are gone...

 

Will there be a yarn about your absence..a free e-copy of your novel....a note from home to explain ?

 

Inquiring minds do't care...but we may

 

[Snowy79]

35 minutes ago, Gary D said:

The magic word in all of this is control. If your lease as a foreigner is giving you control over that land it is illegal, end of.

I'm pretty sure it's not as black and white as that or there wouldn't be billions of dollars investment into the Philippines each year or thousands of Web sites and companies offering leases to foreigners for properties. If that was the case just about every real estate agent in the country that leases a property to a foreigner is depriving a Filipino of that property. I know of a few resorts and dive sites etc that are leased to foreigners, surely this is depriving a Filipino also.

[Gary D]

17 minutes ago, Snowy79 said:

I'm pretty sure it's not as black and white as that or there wouldn't be billions of dollars investment into the Philippines each year or thousands of Web sites and companies offering leases to foreigners for properties. If that was the case just about every real estate agent in the country that leases a property to a foreigner is depriving a Filipino of that property. I know of a few resorts and dive sites etc that are leased to foreigners, surely this is depriving a Filipino also.

Again I will reiterate, it's all about control. There are special arrangements in economic zones for foreign companies. It all depends on the lease, if you want to lease a piece of land for 25-50 years ok but if you are trying to control that land via a lease then it's not ok.

Edited March 4, 2017 by Gary D

[robert k]

1 hour ago, Snowy79 said:

I'm pretty sure it's not as black and white as that or there wouldn't be billions of dollars investment into the Philippines each year or thousands of Web sites and companies offering leases to foreigners for properties. If that was the case just about every real estate agent in the country that leases a property to a foreigner is depriving a Filipino of that property. I know of a few resorts and dive sites etc that are leased to foreigners, surely this is depriving a Filipino also.

Leased BY the government, different story.

[Dave Hounddriver]

13 hours ago, i am bob said:

 But, if we are afraid to step up, hire the best we can to protect our interests and do the things to ensure we are protected to the best of our abilities, why even bother coming here in the first place.

First, I like what you have said and I would not discourage anyone from doing similar, because we foreigners are an adventurous lot.

Now to answer your question about why even bother coming here in the first place I shall give the reply I heard a zillion times when I came here 10 years ago and its still apt today:

Come here to rent, to rent, to rent . .  not to buy but to rent . .  not to long term lease but to rent.   not to beat the system but to rent.  hey did I mention rents are dirt cheap here.   

That was the #1 piece of advice I was given from most expats I met when I first arrived.  Those I knew who had chosen to ignore the advice and "owned" homes 10 years ago, are now pretty much buried or back in their home countries, or divorced/separated and renting somewhere else while someone else lives in their house.  But there are success stories about people "buying" and getting away with it.  There are enough success stories that I took the risk and "bought" something cheap myself.

I have very few success stories about long term leases (or rural banks or high interest investments in Philippines).  Perhaps the next generation will hear some good news from our group in 10 years.  It takes at least that long to see if the plan will be successful.

So in conclusion, whilst I opened saying I would not discourage anyone from buying or long term leasing (if they can afford to lose and walk away) I would also not encourage anyone from buying or long term leasing.

[AlwaysRt]

1 hour ago, Dave Hounddriver said:

First, I like what you have said and I would not discourage anyone from doing similar, because we foreigners are an adventurous lot.

Now to answer your question about why even bother coming here in the first place I shall give the reply I heard a zillion times when I came here 10 years ago and its still apt today:

Come here to rent, to rent, to rent . .  not to buy but to rent . .  not to long term lease but to rent.   not to beat the system but to rent.  hey did I mention rents are dirt cheap here.   

That was the #1 piece of advice I was given from most expats I met when I first arrived.  Those I knew who had chosen to ignore the advice and "owned" homes 10 years ago, are now pretty much buried or back in their home countries, or divorced/separated and renting somewhere else while someone else lives in their house.  But there are success stories about people "buying" and getting away with it.  There are enough success stories that I took the risk and "bought" something cheap myself.

I have very few success stories about long term leases (or rural banks or high interest investments in Philippines).  Perhaps the next generation will hear some good news from our group in 10 years.  It takes at least that long to see if the plan will be successful.

So in conclusion, whilst I opened saying I would not discourage anyone from buying or long term leasing (if they can afford to lose and walk away) I would also not encourage anyone from buying or long term leasing.

100% golden advice to expats heading to ANY "3rd world" country.