Building a Home in Davao

[Snowy79]

13 minutes ago, hk blues said:

I'm sure you probably have the same impression as me, Tom.  The expression "you get what you pay for" here is only true to a point.  Sure, pay a little and you'll get a little, pay a lot you may get a lot! 

I often feel that when we pay a very high premium it's not so much for the quality as much the lack of availability and/or the simple fact if you can afford it you can afford to pay more for it. The 1st factor is fair, the 2nd not so much IMO.

I don't know how much they are paying the workers here but they much have searched high and low to find workers that can look you straight in the eye as you are explaining how you want something done.  They then say " Yes Sir " and do it the way they want to do it with the expected issues that you tried to avoid.

My main issue is the repairs they are doing to the apartment roofs, one year on from when the damage took place with Typhoon Ursula. I've even spoke to the Regional manager here and highlighted the issues they'll have if they continue to be told everything is fine it's OK.  Then speaking to the caretaker of the building finding out all the top floor apartments are leaking.  Head strong and the ability to admit their mistakes is shocking.  I even took the foreman into my apartment which over looks some of the roofs and pointed out the problems. The foreman actually laughed and said " Yes Sir. "  Every other day they have a worker on the roof with a bag of nails feeling for roof tiles sticking up then he nails them down, completely walking past the patch that hasn't even got roof tiles on it, the same patch I've reported 3 times in the last 4 months. 

[RBM]

19 hours ago, Snowy79 said:

I don't know how much they are paying the workers here but they much have searched high and low to find workers that can look you straight in the eye as you are explaining how you want something done.  They then say " Yes Sir " and do it the way they want to do it with the expected issues that you tried to avoid.

My main issue is the repairs they are doing to the apartment roofs, one year on from when the damage took place with Typhoon Ursula. I've even spoke to the Regional manager here and highlighted the issues they'll have if they continue to be told everything is fine it's OK.  Then speaking to the caretaker of the building finding out all the top floor apartments are leaking.  Head strong and the ability to admit their mistakes is shocking.  I even took the foreman into my apartment which over looks some of the roofs and pointed out the problems. The foreman actually laughed and said " Yes Sir. "  Every other day they have a worker on the roof with a bag of nails feeling for roof tiles sticking up then he nails them down, completely walking past the patch that hasn't even got roof tiles on it, the same patch I've reported 3 times in the last 4 months. 

sadly snowy there is no answer for how it really is. We just have to tolerate it and go with the flow. Occasionally one experiences a worker with common sense whom can perform, rare but it just happened to us having a sink replaced. This really gave me a lift and a thrill to know they are out there. I protect his number with my life.

[Snowy79]

11 minutes ago, RBM said:

sadly snowy there is no answer for how it really is. We just have to tolerate it and go with the flow. Occasionally one experiences a worker with common sense whom can perform, rare but it just happened to us having a sink replaced. This really gave me a lift and a thrill to know they are out there. I protect his number with my life.

There's certainly some talent here as I see when I look at some of the native arts and crafts.  Skills way beyond my ability,  I just seam to have a continual run in with those that can't get a job elsewhere. It wouldn't be so bad if they would listen then tell you they aren't quite sure but will give it a try. 

I'm not talking splitting the atom just little things like pointing out that if they fit roof panels like tiles the water will find a way in and the apartments will be flooded. I even showed them overlapping roof panels and explained that this means the water will run off from one and over the next one and so on ensuring that it is impossible for the water to get in. I get the " Yes Sir " and ten minutes later they are on the opposite roof fitting the roofing like tiles. When they come off the roof I ask them why they did it like that and get told it is OK Sir, good job no leak.  The next downpour they have flooded the apartments again and I catch the workers on the roof trying to fill the gaps between the metal sheets with mastic.  I catch them when they come off and tell them that will last a few weeks only but it goes in one ear and out the next. A month later the apartments are flooded again so they decide to stick bitumen roofing tiles on top of the sheets and again only in certain areas and not overlapping.  Next month more leaks.  As I said I'm now over one year down the line and there are still leaks and I can see the repairs that they have done starting to lift again.

You can safely say I'd never do a self build here as my blood pressure couldn't cope. 

[hk blues]

11 minutes ago, Snowy79 said:

There's certainly some talent here as I see when I look at some of the native arts and crafts.  Skills way beyond my ability,  I just seam to have a continual run in with those that can't get a job elsewhere. It wouldn't be so bad if they would listen then tell you they aren't quite sure but will give it a try. 

I'm not talking splitting the atom just little things like pointing out that if they fit roof panels like tiles the water will find a way in and the apartments will be flooded. I even showed them overlapping roof panels and explained that this means the water will run off from one and over the next one and so on ensuring that it is impossible for the water to get in. I get the " Yes Sir " and ten minutes later they are on the opposite roof fitting the roofing like tiles. When they come off the roof I ask them why they did it like that and get told it is OK Sir, good job no leak.  The next downpour they have flooded the apartments again and I catch the workers on the roof trying to fill the gaps between the metal sheets with mastic.  I catch them when they come off and tell them that will last a few weeks only but it goes in one ear and out the next. A month later the apartments are flooded again so they decide to stick bitumen roofing tiles on top of the sheets and again only in certain areas and not overlapping.  Next month more leaks.  As I said I'm now over one year down the line and there are still leaks and I can see the repairs that they have done starting to lift again.

You can safely say I'd never do a self build here as my blood pressure couldn't cope. 

I have to say, Snowy, you do seem to have had experiences beyond what most of us have had - sorry to hear that. My own experience overall I'd rate as a 6/10. I'd probably expect an 8/10 if we were in the UK. Sure, I've had the odd 1/10 but not often - nor more than once!

[RBM]

24 minutes ago, Snowy79 said:

There's certainly some talent here as I see when I look at some of the native arts and crafts.  Skills way beyond my ability,  I just seam to have a continual run in with those that can't get a job elsewhere. It wouldn't be so bad if they would listen then tell you they aren't quite sure but will give it a try. 

I'm not talking splitting the atom just little things like pointing out that if they fit roof panels like tiles the water will find a way in and the apartments will be flooded. I even showed them overlapping roof panels and explained that this means the water will run off from one and over the next one and so on ensuring that it is impossible for the water to get in. I get the " Yes Sir " and ten minutes later they are on the opposite roof fitting the roofing like tiles. When they come off the roof I ask them why they did it like that and get told it is OK Sir, good job no leak.  The next downpour they have flooded the apartments again and I catch the workers on the roof trying to fill the gaps between the metal sheets with mastic.  I catch them when they come off and tell them that will last a few weeks only but it goes in one ear and out the next. A month later the apartments are flooded again so they decide to stick bitumen roofing tiles on top of the sheets and again only in certain areas and not overlapping.  Next month more leaks.  As I said I'm now over one year down the line and there are still leaks and I can see the repairs that they have done starting to lift again.

You can safely say I'd never do a self build here as my blood pressure couldn't cope. 

Beyond my comprehension, yes your really do luck out snowy. These people appear brain dead.

[Tommy T.]

30 minutes ago, Snowy79 said:

There's certainly some talent here as I see when I look at some of the native arts and crafts.  Skills way beyond my ability,  I just seam to have a continual run in with those that can't get a job elsewhere. It wouldn't be so bad if they would listen then tell you they aren't quite sure but will give it a try. 

I'm not talking splitting the atom just little things like pointing out that if they fit roof panels like tiles the water will find a way in and the apartments will be flooded. I even showed them overlapping roof panels and explained that this means the water will run off from one and over the next one and so on ensuring that it is impossible for the water to get in. I get the " Yes Sir " and ten minutes later they are on the opposite roof fitting the roofing like tiles. When they come off the roof I ask them why they did it like that and get told it is OK Sir, good job no leak.  The next downpour they have flooded the apartments again and I catch the workers on the roof trying to fill the gaps between the metal sheets with mastic.  I catch them when they come off and tell them that will last a few weeks only but it goes in one ear and out the next. A month later the apartments are flooded again so they decide to stick bitumen roofing tiles on top of the sheets and again only in certain areas and not overlapping.  Next month more leaks.  As I said I'm now over one year down the line and there are still leaks and I can see the repairs that they have done starting to lift again.

You can safely say I'd never do a self build here as my blood pressure couldn't cope. 

So sorry to hear about your experiences there, Snowy.

Maybe those workers are just playing out their work to keep it going and keep getting paid?

I guess I feel quite lucky to have had the workers here - L or I instruct them and they follow our suggestions. I think we have proven to them that we know our stuff relative to construction and so they listen and do what we request. However, there have been numerous times when we have suggested something and the foreman has suggested alternatives or explained his purpose for doing things certain ways. But it's good to at least have a conversation and reasoning. I have certainly learned a lot about Philippine construction methods... But, again, I would never do this again... I am too old and, as you say, my blood pressure is already high enough!

So just know that there are some here who are competent and willing to learn, or at least go along with requests.

[Snowy79]

I think the issue where I currently live is it is run like a resort with a management team that control everything. Those in power are obviously in position through family connections and not on ability ( sounds familiar ).  I've spoken with another owner an American who has lived in the resort for 12yrs and he admitted he gave up trying to get things done. The manager would have been fired within days in most companies. They have a so called maintenance team of about 20 guys in matching uniforms that look the part and have been living in the resort since last January as they came from Manila and I gree they are dragging the work out to get a wage. They must have cost the resort over 100m peso in lost revenue but the manager just shrugs his shoulders when I aproach him.

[Gandang Smile]

4 hours ago, Snowy79 said:

They have a so called maintenance team of about 20 guys in matching uniforms that look the part and have been living in the resort since last January as they came from Manila and I gree they are dragging the work out to get a wage. They must have cost the resort over 100m peso in lost revenue but the manager just shrugs his shoulders when I aproach him.

This is a recurring theme all over the Philippines. I got the impression years and years ago, that this country prefers to pay P7,000 a month for 3 unskilled employees without a clue or motivation, rather than P21,000 for 1 skilled employee who could do the job much, much better. Maybe that's how they keep the unemployment numbers lower than they are (or should be), I though to myself...

Edited December 31, 2020 by Gandang Smile

[Snowy79]

1 hour ago, Gandang Smile said:

This is a recurring theme all over the Philippines. I got the impression years and years ago, that this country prefers to pay P7,000 a month for 3 unskilled employees without a clue or motivation, rather than P21,000 for 1 skilled employee who could do the job much, much better. Maybe that's how they keep the unemployment numbers lower than they are (or should be), I though to myself...

You may have a good point.  Definitiely a mentality of the more workers you have the more work that get's done.  Fortunately I'm not covering their wages but in the last year I've seen a 2 day job that I jokingly said to the worker will take a week last over a month.  A sign put up and taken down 5 times to make minor adjustments over the space of another month. Grass cutting around the pool area with a proper petrol strimmer which should have taken 2hrs max last over 3 days and the roof repairs still on going after one year.  I could have hand on heart replaced all the roofs myself in that time. I've attached three photos to show you what almost one year of work looks like. On a nice sunny day the tiles lift even higher, it looks like the waves on the sea.  Between the initial damage and the metal sheets been fitted took over 3 months.  Those sheets alone took about two months to fit as the workers have a nice shade to sit under and smoke or even sleep.

[Gandang Smile]

4 minutes ago, Snowy79 said:

You may have a good point.  Definitiely a mentality of the more workers you have the more work that get's done.  Fortunately I'm not covering their wages but in the last year I've seen a 2 day job that I jokingly said to the worker will take a week last over a month.  A sign put up and taken down 5 times to make minor adjustments over the space of another month. Grass cutting around the pool area with a proper petrol strimmer which should have taken 2hrs max last over 3 days and the roof repairs still on going after one year.  I could have hand on heart replaced all the roofs myself in that time. I've attached three photos to show you what almost one year of work looks like. On a nice sunny day the tiles lift even higher, it looks like the waves on the sea.  Between the initial damage and the metal sheets been fitted took over 3 months.  Those sheets alone took about two months to fit as the workers have a nice shade to sit under and smoke or even sleep.

I agree. And most of the times it's lack of entrepreneurship on the labourer's side, that often determines their downfall in terms of wages and employability. You are from the UK and should know how construction workers are encouraged, often obliged, to keep their skills and the equipment they own or use up to date. They get to know that a small investment in terms of training or equipment may pay big time, if a job can be completed faster and to better quality.

Yes, Filipinos can be inventive and resourceful. Kudos for that. Yet, no amount of ingenuity can replace tried and tested methods and tools that would only cost a few thousand pesos of investment.