Electrical problems.

[jimeve]

I have started a new topic about electrics. If you have any electrical problems feel free to post.

I have managed to get in contact with the chap who installed my electrics he will hopefully rectify the problem.  The problem is... the breaker has tripped and the outlets on that circuit has no power.

So I will keep you updated when the electrician has hopefully fixed the problem.    

[Gary D]

35 minutes ago, jimeve said:

I have started a new topic about electrics. If you have any electrical problems feel free to post.

I have managed to get in contact with the chap who installed my electrics he will hopefully rectify the problem.  The problem is... the breaker has tripped and the outlets on that circuit has no power.

So I will keep you updated when the electrician has hopefully fixed the problem.    

I wonder which leg the breaker is in.

[Tommy T.]

2 hours ago, jimeve said:

I have managed to get in contact with the chap who installed my electrics he will hopefully rectify the problem.  The problem is... the breaker has tripped and the outlets on that circuit has no power.

 

Okay, Jim... I have a couple of really stupid questions...

Did you try resetting the breaker when nothing was plugged into that circuit? And if so, did it trip again right away? If that happened, you've got a dead short in that circuit, so leave it alone until your guy shows up and don't bother reading the rest of this post!

If it didn't trip right away, then try plugging in a light or fan that you know works... If it still doesn't trip, then try plugging in the heavy appliance and see if that trips it. If so, then the appliance has a short or the circuit breaker - and possibly even the wiring - are not robust enough for that appliance.

Look at the breakers themselves. The main breaker will have an amperage rating - here in the apartment it is 40A - meaning 40 amperes maximum load. The math here is watts = amps x volts. What that means, is that your total house power use cannot exceed 40 amps or (40 x 240 volts = 9,600 watts, load or it will trip the breaker. And it's better to stay well below that because your wiring might get warm anyway. It's always best to be safe.

The breakers for the various circuits in the house will have lower values - typically 20A or 20 amps maximum load for each breaker. Look at the bottom breaker in the photo and you can just barely read the 20A. Same equation yields 20 x 240 = 4,800 watts on any one circuit. That's a lot of watts, actually. Any appliance that creates heat uses lots of power and they are the ones that really load up your circuits. Every new appliance has it's load listed on a tag or stamped on the back or on the wall plug itself (maybe other places too). So you simply should check the power use of each appliance to see how many of each you can plug into a single circuit.

Air conditioners usually list their power use in horsepower - I have no idea why that is. But here is a general guideline for you... 1 horsepower = 745.7 watts. .. So round up a bit and just figure that every hp your air con is rated for will burn about 750 watts. So a 2 hp unit will use 1,500 watts. That may not be the continuous power draw, but only when the compressor is running. And a final note about aircons and any appliance with an electric motor: they always draw more when they first start up, then they gradually use less. The inverter models do not draw a lot more when starting because they run differently - that's a whole other topic and already covered in another thread a while ago.

Just for your information... The main breaker in our new home will have a 150A main breaker and 20 breakers in the sub-circuits - 20A rated for the lighting circuits and 30A for the water heater and aircon circuits. It is, admittedly probably a bit over-engineered. But then I don't want to have any fires caused by inadequate wiring...

One final note here, Jim. Just be careful. I intend to try to draw no more than maybe 50%-60% of the rated load in our new house on any circuit. I hope this explains the workings a bit for you and that I didn't get too technical...

[hk blues]

36 minutes ago, Tommy T. said:

One final note here, Jim. Just be careful. 

He is Tom - that's why he is calling in an electrician!

[Tommy T.]

7 minutes ago, hk blues said:

He is Tom - that's why he is calling in an electrician!

I know, I know... Sometimes I get carried away with myself. Sorry...  I guess I was trying educate him somewhat and at the beginning I was hoping to give him a couple of simple tests he could try to eliminate considering simple problems. It also gave me a chance to try to re-activate a few dormant or rum-soaked brain cells

Actually, I had to calculate the loads when living on the yacht so I could figure out how many solar panels and how many batteries and wire sizes and breaker sizes too. So I will carry that on in the new house too. I am not referred to by friends as anally retentive for nothing!!!

Edited October 18, 2019 by Tommy T.

[jimeve]

1 hour ago, Tommy T. said:

Did you try resetting the breaker when nothing was plugged into that circuit? And if so, did it trip again right away? If that happened, you've got a dead short in that circuit, so leave it alone until your guy shows up and don't bother reading the rest of this post!

Thanks for your detailed and technical reply. Yeah tried resetting did not trip but still no power in the outlets at all. It is a 20 amp breaker. I have an electrician coming tomorrow hopefully he will sort it out.

I will let you know of the outcome when he's done. Oh and when it tripped first time there was no load , i switched everything off before I went to bed,  it had tripped during the night without any load.

[Tommy T.]

14 minutes ago, jimeve said:

Thanks for your detailed and technical reply. Yeah tried resetting did not trip but still no power in the outlets at all. It is a 20 amp breaker. I have an electrician coming tomorrow hopefully he will sort it out.

I will let you know of the outcome when he's done. Oh and when it tripped first time there was no load , i switched everything off before I went to bed,  it had tripped during the night without any load.

I see... Oh well... I tried. Thanks for trying the first check. I suggest you watch over his shoulder as he works and take pictures if you wish. I am very curious about this now. Most Filipinos love to have their photos taken! You explained the situation very clearly now so I understand it. I am puzzled why it would trip without load - have you been watching too much Twilight Zone, Jim? Sounds like it might just be a gremlin...

Edited October 18, 2019 by Tommy T.

[hk blues]

1 hour ago, Tommy T. said:

I know, I know... Sometimes I get carried away with myself. Sorry...  I guess I was trying educate him somewhat and at the beginning I was hoping to give him a couple of simple tests he could try to eliminate considering simple problems. It also gave me a chance to try to re-activate a few dormant or rum-soaked brain cells

Actually, I had to calculate the loads when living on the yacht so I could figure out how many solar panels and how many batteries and wire sizes and breaker sizes too. So I will carry that on in the new house too. I am not referred to by friends as anally retentive for nothing!!!

Apologies not necessary Tom - information is always valuable!  

[Gary D]

19 minutes ago, jimeve said:

Thanks for your detailed and technical reply. Yeah tried resetting did not trip but still no power in the outlets at all. It is a 20 amp breaker. I have an electrician coming tomorrow hopefully he will sort it out.

I will let you know of the outcome when he's done. Oh and when it tripped first time there was no load , i switched everything off before I went to bed,  it had tripped during the night without any load.

I assume you have a separate breaker for lights and outlets, here in the provinces we don't even have breakers let alone separate circuits. We had a breaker fail last year, a uk breaker, the first time I've seen it happen. So lights still work, not a brownout or forgot to pay the bill.

[Gary D]

2 hours ago, Tommy T. said:

Okay, Jim... I have a couple of really stupid questions...

Did you try resetting the breaker when nothing was plugged into that circuit? And if so, did it trip again right away? If that happened, you've got a dead short in that circuit, so leave it alone until your guy shows up and don't bother reading the rest of this post!

If it didn't trip right away, then try plugging in a light or fan that you know works... If it still doesn't trip, then try plugging in the heavy appliance and see if that trips it. If so, then the appliance has a short or the circuit breaker - and possibly even the wiring - are not robust enough for that appliance.

Look at the breakers themselves. The main breaker will have an amperage rating - here in the apartment it is 40A - meaning 40 amperes maximum load. The math here is watts = amps x volts. What that means, is that your total house power use cannot exceed 40 amps or (40 x 240 volts = 9,600 watts, load or it will trip the breaker. And it's better to stay well below that because your wiring might get warm anyway. It's always best to be safe.

The breakers for the various circuits in the house will have lower values - typically 20A or 20 amps maximum load for each breaker. Look at the bottom breaker in the photo and you can just barely read the 20A. Same equation yields 20 x 240 = 4,800 watts on any one circuit. That's a lot of watts, actually. Any appliance that creates heat uses lots of power and they are the ones that really load up your circuits. Every new appliance has it's load listed on a tag or stamped on the back or on the wall plug itself (maybe other places too). So you simply should check the power use of each appliance to see how many of each you can plug into a single circuit.

Air conditioners usually list their power use in horsepower - I have no idea why that is. But here is a general guideline for you... 1 horsepower = 745.7 watts. .. So round up a bit and just figure that every hp your air con is rated for will burn about 750 watts. So a 2 hp unit will use 1,500 watts. That may not be the continuous power draw, but only when the compressor is running. And a final note about aircons and any appliance with an electric motor: they always draw more when they first start up, then they gradually use less. The inverter models do not draw a lot more when starting because they run differently - that's a whole other topic and already covered in another thread a while ago.

Just for your information... The main breaker in our new home will have a 150A main breaker and 20 breakers in the sub-circuits - 20A rated for the lighting circuits and 30A for the water heater and aircon circuits. It is, admittedly probably a bit over-engineered. But then I don't want to have any fires caused by inadequate wiring...

One final note here, Jim. Just be careful. I intend to try to draw no more than maybe 50%-60% of the rated load in our new house on any circuit. I hope this explains the workings a bit for you and that I didn't get too technical...

20 amps for the lights, that sounds a bit extreme, I use 6 amp breakers for the light, with LED lighting even that's a bit extreme.