Philippines education standards today

[Gandang Smile]

Edit; 

This great topic is split from another; What is the state of Filipino educational system today? 

From, Smiles/HK/Terry/Snowy and so on......

End edit;

Until a few years ago I would reason along your lines exactly: they need that little cash more than I do, there's no welfare and lots of family pressure, etc.

So long foreign tourists are happy to pretend that they are the smart ones, until they realise they're not and have been fleeced left right and center, the game will go on.

So long young women (and men) keep wanting to take the "path of least resistance" to success, which basically means money and stuff to show off, the game will go on.

You might have been in the Philippines long enough to know this country has a pretty good public education system that is completely free of tuition costs for families of poor or modest backgrounds. They have Philippine Science at high school level and the University of the Philippines at college level.

If a girl or a boy really wants to work hard, they can sit the entrance exam for Philippine Science, pass it and they will have elite STEM education (by Philippine standards, at least) without paying a centavo. A Philippine Science diploma is one of the best way to get a scholarship at any of the good private universities, like the Ateneo o La Salle colleges around the archipelago. The only requirement for a Philippine Science graduate is that he or she takes a STEM course at college.

If they prefer to continue with the public system, they can enter a University of the Philippines college. Again, a competitive entrance exam but Philippine Science graduates usually have a massive edge over everybody else.

This system is open to every child in the Philippines, male or female, rich or poor, living in Makati or the most remote corner of Mindanao.

Once I learned this, I could no longer patronise and discount the typical story of the poor girl who doesn't have money to pay for her college. Most of the times the money they get from their "boyfriends" online goes to buy the latest electronic gadget or a few party with their friends. Some of them do remember that they have to pay for their college semester but never panic: there's always going to be another chicken online. Worst case scenario, if they are physically passable, a few days locked in a hotel room with a local or foreign man will solve the problem.

The point I am making is: when the girls know that they can satisfy their basic needs (and then some) so easily and without putting any real intellectual effort, anything more than using their faces and bodies, whatever little motivation they might have, to enrol in college or keep studying, will go away.

Caption: these kids are 100% guaranteed they won't scam anyone.

Edited January 8, 2021 by Old55
Split into new topic

[hk blues]

4 minutes ago, hk blues said:

Whilst I don't necessarily agree with all of this, much of it is not far from my way of thinking.

It's mainly on the availability/provision of quality education for the poorer sections of society here.  Whilst there is a provision it probably doesn't really provide many opportunities for anything but the best, or at least the better, students - the middle and below probably get left behind.  That said, I'd be interested to find out what economic group (for want of a better expression) the online fraudsters fall into - I wouldn't be at all surprised if they were NOT in the lowest group. 

[Gandang Smile]

9 minutes ago, hk blues said:

It's mainly on the availability/provision of quality education for the poorer sections of society here.  Whilst there is a provision it probably doesn't really provide many opportunities for anything but the best, or at least the better, students - the middle and below probably get left behind.  That said, I'd be interested to find out what economic group (for want of a better expression) the online fraudsters fall into - I wouldn't be at all surprised if they were NOT in the lowest group. 

Well, that was kind of my points. Even the poorest kids can access Philippine Science and then go on to UP.

Besides this elite tier, there are plenty of public universities and polytechnic in every major city, where the tuition is not so high and there are plenty of scholarships available. Davao alone has University of the Southeastern Philippines (USEP) and University of Mindanao (UM) which give decent education for not so much as a few hundred dollars a year.

My concern, which you may or may not agree with, is the lack of stimuli kids have in the more rural and remote areas. True, some kids are born with a superior intelligence and they somehow find a way to start going to a good school and rise to the occasion.

Most kids end up living with families who don't have a single book or newspaper in their homes. Many of them are too lazy, or too demotivated to even try making an effort. These are the girls and boys who end up running dubious businesses, scamming foreigners online and selling their bodies to locals for a few hundred pesos.

What economic group online fraudsters fall into? I think we both know the answer. Foreigners online are actually the easiest people to scam. Scamming fellow Pinoys with the "get rich tomorrow" Ponzi schemes, which abound especially down in Visayas and Mindanao, usually requires a bit more charisma and intelligence to set up the structure and go unnoticed for a long time. 

 

[Snowy79]

7 minutes ago, Gandang Smile said:

I would be interested to know where your opinion diverges.

My experience of the education system has been slightly different from yours.  I was Vice President of the Parent Teachers association at a private school in Oriental Mindoro and did plenty of ground work to find my partner's kid a school whilst at the same time she was continuing to study to be a teacher.  I also researched courses for University in the future. 

What I found was the standard of education in the area I was in is shocking, a fact backed up by many foreigners who moved back to their countries with their kids to give them a chance at a decent education.  I'm not saying there's no good schools around or that they can't get their education for free but it's only the lessons that are free.  I know a few families that are struggling to buy their book, band paper and craft items needed to complete their course work.

Through the PTA I met a few families that sacrificed everything to allow one family member to graduate.  My partner at the time her two brothers dropped out of school to give the money that was required for materials just to complete the course work.  She manged to complete two years at University in Cebu before the family ran out of money.  Boarding and food away from the family wasn't free. She ended up trying to finish her degree by retraining as a teacher as it was the only compatible training she could do in our area. The standard of teaching was shocking with an emphasis on the more money she contributes to the school the better her grades were. 

Her daughter is extremely bright so looking to the future we tried to plan what College or University to go to and found only a few with decent reputations and that again would have meant upping sticks and moving to a City. 

Obviously many people's mileage may vary but start with a family of 6 which isn't out of the ordinary here and work out the cost involved outside of the education.  Transport materials, food etc.  Many families are on under 15k peso per month. The guy I used to transport her daughter to school had 5 kids and earned between 200 and 500 peso per day depending on the weather.

[Gandang Smile]

8 minutes ago, Snowy79 said:

My experience of the education system has been slightly different from yours.  I was Vice President of the Parent Teachers association at a private school in Oriental Mindoro and did plenty of ground work to find my partner's kid a school whilst at the same time she was continuing to study to be a teacher.  I also researched courses for University in the future. 

What I found was the standard of education in the area I was in is shocking, a fact backed up by many foreigners who moved back to their countries with their kids to give them a chance at a decent education.  I'm not saying there's no good schools around or that they can't get their education for free but it's only the lessons that are free.  I know a few families that are struggling to buy their book, band paper and craft items needed to complete their course work.

Through the PTA I met a few families that sacrificed everything to allow one family member to graduate.  My partner at the time her two brothers dropped out of school to give the money that was required for materials just to complete the course work.  She manged to complete two years at University in Cebu before the family ran out of money.  Boarding and food away from the family wasn't free. She ended up trying to finish her degree by retraining as a teacher as it was the only compatible training she could do in our area. The standard of teaching was shocking with an emphasis on the more money she contributes to the school the better her grades were. 

Her daughter is extremely bright so looking to the future we tried to plan what College or University to go to and found only a few with decent reputations and that again would have meant upping sticks and moving to a City. 

Obviously many people's mileage may vary but start with a family of 6 which isn't out of the ordinary here and work out the cost involved outside of the education.  Transport materials, food etc.  Many families are on under 15k peso per month. The guy I used to transport her daughter to school had 5 kids and earned between 200 and 500 peso per day depending on the weather.

I perfectly understand. True, tuition is free but extra costs like boarding, books and stationery, and transportation are far from trivial and they have to get multiplied by the number of kids in a family.

Still, one or two well-educated children out of 5 or 6 is still a better result that none.

Also, as you might have noticed while doing your research, private high schools and "academies" offering low-quality and comparably expensive courses abound. Some kids tend to get lured into one of these diploma factories where usually there's a total lack of educational and even ethical standards. By ethical I mean, lecturers who are all too happy to ask for sexual favours from underage girls and boys in exchange for a better grade or a pass mark.

I won't make names, but I would hazard that these private colleges makes at least 30% of the total, maybe more.

The few times I was asked my opinion on this by a concerned student or parent (I had 8 interns during my time with the Davao company, and screened many more), I would always answer that it would always be best to strive for a quality public school in the big city, rather than a Mickey Mouse school closer to home.

As it struck me, many times these kids didn't know better because their families didn't know better.

Edited January 8, 2021 by Gandang Smile

[hk blues]

27 minutes ago, Gandang Smile said:

Well, that was kind of my points. Even the poorest kids can access Philippine Science and then go on to UP.

Besides this elite tier, there are plenty of public universities and polytechnic in every major city, where the tuition is not so high and there are plenty of scholarships available. Davao alone has University of the Southeastern Philippines (USEP) and University of Mindanao (UM) which give decent education for not so much as a few hundred dollars a year.

My concern, which you may or may not agree with, is the lack of stimuli kids have in the more rural and remote areas. True, some kids are born with a superior intelligence and they somehow find a way to start going to a good school and rise to the occasion.

Most kids end up living with families who don't have a single book or newspaper in their homes. Many of them are too lazy, or too demotivated to even try making an effort. These are the girls and boys who end up running dubious businesses, scamming foreigners online and selling their bodies to locals for a few hundred pesos.

What economic group online fraudsters fall into? I think we both know the answer. Foreigners online are actually the easiest people to scam. Scamming fellow Pinoys with the "get rich tomorrow" Ponzi schemes, which abound especially down in Visayas and Mindanao, usually requires a bit more charisma and intelligence to set up the structure and go unnoticed for a long time. 

 

I doubt you or I have the data to support our views, but I'd be surprised if these online scam businesses are using girls (or boys) from the poorest groups/places.  Poorer, yes - poorest - no.

I do think you are overestimating the quality of education available IN GENERAL here, and also the ability of many to pay even a few hundred dollars is beyond the means of many. 

Anyhow, you asked where our opinions diverged so I've explained.  

[Gandang Smile]

43 minutes ago, hk blues said:

I doubt you or I have the data to support our views, but I'd be surprised if these online scam businesses are using girls (or boys) from the poorest groups/places.  Poorer, yes - poorest - no.

I do think you are overestimating the quality of education available IN GENERAL here, and also the ability of many to pay even a few hundred dollars is beyond the means of many. 

Anyhow, you asked where our opinions diverged so I've explained.  

You're right, I don't think there are statistics on the demographics of those who scam and those who get scammed, although I would guess the "scammed" are on average poorer and less educated than the "scammers". 

The paradox is that these poor(er) people are so easily convinced that they have the opportunity of a lifetime and can double their initial investment in 3 months, that they would go to great lengths to procure that investment money. Many would borrow from some close family member or friend, with the embarrassing consequence of having to justify themselves when they don't even get the principal back after 3 months (or 3 years, for that matter).

One of the last few Filipinos I trusted, my former company accountant, at some point asked me for 100K towards "her mom's heart surgery". He said her mom, also an accountant, had helped me with some BIR paperwork to close the company and I felt somehow compelled to loan that money. I made it very clear that it was going to be a loan.

Long story short, I have a very good reason to believe that he did not use that money for his mom's surgery. In fact the whole surgery might have well been an excuse. He "invested" that money on one of the many Ponzi scheme. I was even invited to one of their meetings, at some small hotel in Davao, and it was absolutely pathetic, with these self-proclaimed "finance gurus" talking about the "Bitcoin revolution", offering their own crypto-token in exchange for their cash and promising a 200% return in 3 months. Nothing we haven't heard about before...

To close the loop, no amount of college education would replace good old common sense. I would have guessed at least half of the people in the hotel room were middle class, with a university degree of some sort, and a job in the public or private sector.

As someone old and wise once said...one doesn't get an education to avoid being scammed. One gets an education to understand they shouldn't be scamming. 

[Terry P]

As recently as November last Dyson announced they are opening an R&D and software development facility in the Philippines employing 400 engineers in the software department alone as part of their global development programme. They claim they will have no problems finding the necessary talent in the country.

If the Philippines education system is in such disarray and a fair proportion of the younger generation are not getting a decent standard of education for whatever reason shouldn't they be advised of the error of their judgement

Everyone in this topic I think is in agreement that there is a certain amount of good education facilities but is that the obviously limited amount of talent pool will be snapped up by the players already in the field

[Kuya John]

1 hour ago, TerryP said:

As recently as November last Dyson announced they are opening an R&D and software development facility in the Philippines

Forgive me to digress just for a moment.....

Is that the same Dyson who encouraged people to vote for Brexit and then moved his HQ to Singapore?

Only asking

[Terry P]

4 minutes ago, Kuya John said:

Forgive me to digress just for a moment.....

Is that the same Dyson who encouraged people to vote for Brexit and then moved his HQ to Singapore?

Only asking

Correct as usual

Tax avoidance is the respectable handle