Why Do Some Expats Whine On & On

[UZI]

I have to say, when I read comments here and on other forums whining on about what a scam it is that they have to pay a few thousand Peso to keep extending their VISIT, (for example Visa Extension thread) I think a reality check is needed. How much do their own countries charge Filipino's (if they can even get) for a Tourist Visa? The USA charges $140 and the UK a similar amount for a MAXIMUM of 6 months. Way more than the RP charges us relatively rich foreigners AND we get the 1st 3 weeks FREE. Balikbayans get to stay 1 year with additional perks for free. Tourists get to stay for up to 2 years with VERY little red tape and IMHO little cost for the privilege not generally offered by other countries. If married to a Filipino then you get to stay via a section 13 visa for life, again for less than $400 (over $1,000 in UK). I entered on a Balikbayan & processed my 13a at that time. Simple process with no hassles to speak of & now just pay P310 a year. I would be interested to hear from members as to why they think this is a scam? Or do some just like moaning on forums? ......... or am I the only one who doesn't think that way?

Edited July 15, 2010 by UZI

[Mr Lee]

I have to say, when I read comments here and on other forums whining on about what a scam it is that they have to pay a few thousand Peso to keep extending their VISIT, (for example Visa Extension thread) I think a reality check is needed. How much do their own countries charge Filipino's (if they can even get) for a Tourist Visa? The USA charges $140 and the UK a similar amount for a MAXIMUM of 6 months. Way more than the RP charges us relatively rich foreigners AND we get the 1st 3 weeks FREE. Balikbayans get to stay 1 year with additional perks for free. Tourists get to stay for up to 2 years with VERY little red tape and IMHO little cost for the privilege not generally offered by other countries. If married to a Filipino then you get to stay via a section 13 visa for life, again for less than $400 (over $1,000 in UK). I entered on a Balikbayan & processed my 13a at that time. Simple process with no hassles to speak of & now just pay P310 a year. I would be interested to hear from members as to why they think this is a scam? Or do some just like moaning on forums? ......... or am I the only one who doesn't think that way?

While I do not see any real moaning on this issue on this forum, I have seen it on other forums and I often wondered why people were complaining and then I talked to some and found out that they were living on a small fixed income pension and the higher fees were hurting their style of living. I think it often comes down to the fact that no one likes when costs of living goes up and will often bitch about any major increases.  In the case of visas, I feel a lot of people have a problem with the fast lane fee because of its name and not because of the cost. It is my opinion that the Philippines should call a spade a spade and just charge one total fee and on fees that must be paid and stop calling them all different names. I guess I am really no one to speak on this topic because I am lucky enough to be able to enter and stay on a Balikbayan stamp every time we enter the Philippines and I have considered a 13a but see no advantage to it for us since we do not live full time in the Philippines. Last, the other thing why people complain is because they have freedom of speech and I personally think it is a good thing that we can all voice our opinions because I know that newspapers and government officials read forums and if we all said "oh what a great deal visa fees are" then the BI would be sure to raise them again and again and since incomes are not going up for most retirees, and in fact income has gone down for many due to the economic downturn, extra fees can really hurt many and I know of a number of US retirees living in the Philippines that have had to give up their Medicare because they are now hurting due to the US increasing Medicare fees and not increasing their social security for the next three years, but that is another topic and probably best not to get into it because there would surely be many more gripes on that than on BI fees.Whooops really last :lol: it is hard for many of us who do not live on a tight budget to understand how those that have to, think, and since I mingle with many expats and most are honest with me, I happen to know that many are having to cut out things such as aircon because of the ever increasing costs of life in the Philippines such as electric, BI fees and foods to name a few things that keep going up and slowly making it so life will soon no longer be cheap to live in the Philippines for many who go there because they cannot survive back in their own countries.  I feel the Philippines better wake up and at least try to make it easier for foreigners to live there or they may find many leaving, or not coming at all, and going to live in other countries that seem to appreciate the money we all spend while living in their countries.

[Art2ro]

Since my post was used as a reference, let's get one thing straight! At least I provided the facts and our personal experience for the past 12 years and for which that some Balikbayans may be interested in reading my post and or who may want to look into this option of saving money before their BB Stamp is about to expire and want to stay longer in the Philippines! Given the choice of paying P28,000 vs P42,000 for 12 months worth of extensions for husband and wife, which will one chose? Wouldn't anyone think that this would be a savings for those on a tight budget? Would anyone be interested in this? So, if any Balikbayans are out there nearing their BB stamp's expiration date and want to stay longer and want to save some of their hard earned money, check out my article if one can still avail the 6 month extension up to 2 years! Hey, a 5 day turnaround vacation to Thailand may be cheaper, been there and done that too 4 years ago! I myself don't know if there has been a revision to the 6 month extension ruling under RA 6768! You be the judge if it is worth your while to look into it! Good luck!Some Balikbayans aren't ready to stay in the Philippines indefinitely and so, they just use the BB stamp for now. At least there's other options for Balikbayans not like those for your average tourists! That is the true reality check for some! Lucky for those who already have their 13a or 13g permanent resident visas, but they do expire eventually! I also heard of stories people processing their 13a or 13g and ended up paying grease money of P20,000 to P50,000 to fixers in order to speed up the process or getting screwed by fixers walking away with their money paid in full and still no 13a visa! Just dumb luck for some I guess! As I mentioned in my post, prior to our BB stamp from expiring, we were able to get the 6 month extensions every 6 months up to 2 years in the past, which only cost us P28,000 for a total of 12 months for two, don't know what it is today! We didn't decide to do the 6 month extension this time around and went the regular every 59 day tourist extensions and just for 12 months worth of extensions, it will cost us approximately P42,000 which may not be a lot to some people! So now, does every one understand where I'm coming from? Anyone see the obvious scam or scheme in this visa extension scenario, even though it is only a difference of P14,000 between the two types of visa extensions for 12 months? Where as some may consider it whining or moaning, but far from it, it's just the facts and our experiences as I mentioned, no arm chair expert here! Can anyone dispute the facts I've mentioned in my post, which has minor errors in my math, but corrected them here? I just posted the article to help those who may be in need of help to save money especially for those on a tight budget! Nothing is for certain anymore when it comes to doing business at any local satellite BI office, because policies and rules are constantly changing and some of the BI officials may not be knowledgeable of their own rules and policies and or just got out of bed from the wrong side or just didn't have their morning coffee before going to their 9 to 5 desk jobs!

Edited July 15, 2010 by MrBBtheFilAm

[UZI]

I have to say, when I read comments here and on other forums whining on about what a scam it is that they have to pay a few thousand Peso to keep extending their VISIT, (for example Visa Extension thread) I think a reality check is needed. How much do their own countries charge Filipino's (if they can even get) for a Tourist Visa? The USA charges $140 and the UK a similar amount for a MAXIMUM of 6 months. Way more than the RP charges us relatively rich foreigners AND we get the 1st 3 weeks FREE. Balikbayans get to stay 1 year with additional perks for free. Tourists get to stay for up to 2 years with VERY little red tape and IMHO little cost for the privilege not generally offered by other countries. If married to a Filipino then you get to stay via a section 13 visa for life, again for less than $400 (over $1,000 in UK). I entered on a Balikbayan & processed my 13a at that time. Simple process with no hassles to speak of & now just pay P310 a year. I would be interested to hear from members as to why they think this is a scam? Or do some just like moaning on forums? ......... or am I the only one who doesn't think that way?

While I do not see any real moaning on this issue on this forum, I have seen it on other forums and I often wondered why people were complaining and then I talked to some and found out that they were living on a small fixed income pension and the higher fees were hurting their style of living. I think it often comes down to the fact that no one likes when costs of living goes up and will often bitch about any major increases. In the case of visas, I feel a lot of people have a problem with the fast lane fee because of its name and not because of the cost. It is my opinion that the Philippines should call a spade a spade and just charge one total fee and on fees that must be paid and stop calling them all different names. I guess I am really no one to speak on this topic because I am lucky enough to be able to enter and stay on a Balikbayan stamp every time we enter the Philippines and I have considered a 13a but see no advantage to it for us since we do not live full time in the Philippines. Last, the other thing why people complain is because they have freedom of speech and I personally think it is a good thing that we can all voice our opinions because I know that newspapers and government officials read forums and if we all said "oh what a great deal visa fees are" then the BI would be sure to raise them again and again and since incomes are not going up for most retirees, and in fact income has gone down for many due to the economic downturn, extra fees can really hurt many and I know of a number of US retirees living in the Philippines that have had to give up their Medicare because they are now hurting due to the US increasing Medicare fees and not increasing their social security for the next three years, but that is another topic and probably best not to get into it because there would surely be many more gripes on that than on BI fees.Whooops really last :lol: it is hard for many of us who do not live on a tight budget to understand how those that have to, think, and since I mingle with many expats and most are honest with me, I happen to know that many are having to cut out things such as aircon because of the ever increasing costs of life in the Philippines such as electric, BI fees and foods to name a few things that keep going up and slowly making it so life will soon no longer be cheap to live in the Philippines for many who go there because they cannot survive back in their own countries. I feel the Philippines better wake up and at least try to make it easier for foreigners to live there or they may find many leaving, or not coming at all, and going to live in other countries that seem to appreciate the money we all spend while living in their countries.

Hi Lee, As usual, a well considered & thoughtful reply. I totally agree with your POV on retirees who are here for the lower cost of living and are on a fixed small pension. There are many Europeans who are really hurting due to the exchange rates being so low. I for one has seen a real drop in income of about 30% over the last 4 years. I am lucky that I budgeted for such a thing but others may not have had the foresight. I have to say though, that some who whine & moan are not on tight budgets & openly brag about their large electric bill for aircons on 24/7 and shopping bills. As for your 'express lane' quote, I think it is correct that this is an issue but only because it is added automatically instead of being offered as a choice. I remember reading once some time back, of an expat who took issue with this at BI & they refunded his P500 and was told to return a few days later. Did he make a point - yes but was it worth P500. As for MR's reference to those who pay P20 -50k for fixers, that is there choice to use an agent to do the running around for them, it is NOT needed or a scam by the BI. Perhaps Ancienrocka has some input on this 6 month extension issue. As for your closing comment Lee:

I feel the Philippines better wake up and at least try to make it easier for foreigners to live there or they may find many leaving, or not coming at all, and going to live in other countries that seem to appreciate the money we all spend while living in their countries.

My point in the OP was what other country offers the chance for foreigners to live long term without large sums in their 'Retirement Program' ? Not Malaysia or Thailand or USA or UK. So what countries are those, who are here because Filipinas like old(er) men supposed to go to to spend their pensions? Happy with his decision Uzi

[Mr Lee]

 

Hi Lee, As usual, a well considered & thoughtful reply. I totally agree with your POV on retirees who are here for the lower cost of living and are on a fixed small pension. There are many Europeans who are really hurting due to the exchange rates being so low. I for one has seen a real drop in income of about 30% over the last 4 years. I am lucky that I budgeted for such a thing but others may not have had the foresight.

Thank you for the kind words. :lol: Uzi I am glad you had the foresight and means to prepare, I did too but I also realize that not everyone is as fortunate and you or I may be, or may have had the luck of being in the right place at the right time that I feel that I have been lucky enough to have had during my life.

I have to say though, that some who whine & moan are not on tight budgets & openly brag about their large electric bill for aircons on 24/7 and shopping bills. As for your 'express lane' quote, I think it is correct that this is an issue but only because it is added automatically instead of being offered as a choice. I remember reading once some time back, of an expat who took issue with this at BI & they refunded his P500 and was told to return a few days later. Did he make a point - yes but was it worth P500. As for MR's reference to those who pay P20 -50k for fixers, that is there choice to use an agent to do the running around for them, it is NOT needed or a scam by the BI.

I learned long ago that we all have different priorities in life, some of us cannot give up our meat, some refuse to give up their booze and yet others such as myself refuse to give up my comfort or meats, so I sacrifice in other categories to have the things that I deem the most important.I also learned a long time ago while in the Pawn business that many people put up a good front and live large while actually being poor or middle of the road, so I learned to never judge a book by its cover. When I was in business I leased a Lexus and I had friends tell me that if they had my money that they would throw away their money and some of those people were living in mansions, so often life is a perception and not a reality because I know for a fact that those people who said that, had a lot more money than I could ever dream of ever having, and who am I to count their money anyway. So just because a person likes one thing or another, I have found that they can still be living on a tight budget to be able to fulfill their life dreams and ambitions and possibly also leave something behind for their wives. 

Perhaps Ancienrocka has some input on this 6 month extension issue. As for your closing comment Lee: 

Hopefully he will because I respect Paul and know how hard he is working so he can live in the Philippines with his beautiful wife. 

 I feel the Philippines better wake up and at least try to make it easier for foreigners to live there or they may find many leaving, or not coming at all, and going to live in other countries that seem to appreciate the money we all spend while living in their countries.

 

My point in the OP was what other country offers the chance for foreigners to live long term without large sums in their 'Retirement Program' ? Not Malaysia or Thailand or USA or UK. So what countries are those, who are here because Filipinas like old(er) men supposed to go to to spend their pensions? Happy with his decision Uzi

I do not know about all places but I do know that places such as Panama do their best to make living in their country much easier than the Philippines makes it for many of the expats who seem to reside there. So I guess what I was saying with my comment is that people have choices in life and when the Philippines is no longer much less expensive to live than the US or other countries, then less people while wish to move there.  Example, homes, condos and even land is much less expensive in Florida and also in other parts of the country. I can now buy a used 1 bedroom 1 bath condo here for about $10,000 and a 2 bedroom 2 bath for under $20,000 and while those units come with a few hundred dollars a month condo dues, much smaller condos and homes are selling in the Philippines for many times the units here would be selling for. So if prices keep going up in the Philippines for land, homes and condos, then rents are sure to follow and we already know that electric and western foods are higher there than here, so my point is that they need to keep BI fees down and try to get a handle on electric costs, in order to draw more retirees, because I feel the Philippine government is short sighted and does not see what a benefit it is to have so many retirees spending their money brought in from their home countries because a lot of that money does not go through the normal bank exchange process, so they may have no way of knowing just how much they are missing out on if it were all to stop one day or the influx were to come to a standstill.  While the Philippines is paradise for many of us, IMO it can be hell when costs continue to rise to such a point that too many people have to cut out doing the many things they moved their in the first place to do. One of my suggestions for the BI is that if they wish to keep rates up, that they do so by offering convenience such as the option to pay for longer stays at one stop, or offer those who have higher pensions longer visas so they can spend that money in the Philippines instead of traveling, or move the BI near or in a mall so people can do two things in once.  Convenience speaks volumes to some people, while for others it is just about how much an item cost.

[UZI]

One of my suggestions for the BI is that if they wish to keep rates up, that they do so by offering convenience such as the option to pay for longer stays at one stop, or offer those who have higher pensions longer visas so they can spend that money in the Philippines instead of traveling, or move the BI near or in a mall so people can do two things in once. Convenience speaks volumes to some people, while for others it is just about how much an item cost.

Lee,The BI must have been listening to you because they are indeed adding satellite offices. A new one opened in Sta Rosa which was 10 minutes drive from where I lived. Great for annual report & for those who extend their visa every 2 months without needing to go to Manila. Uzi

[Art2ro]

I do try to help others whenever I can by posting important information related to facts and of our experiences to help those who maybe in need of help! For instance, the reason why I brought up the subject of the long lost or ignored 6 month extension under RA 6768, was that I saw a few disabled people wheel chair bounded and the BI office in Sta. Rosa, Laguna isn't wheel chair accessible, where the handicapped individual had to be dragged up the stairs! So, if the Balikbayan 6 month extension is still available according to the existing memorandum, only 2 visits a year will suffice instead of the every 59 day extensions! Because from what I've experienced recently, when the BB stamp is about to expire, we reverted back to tourist status and forced to do the 59 day tourist visa extensions up to 16 months! Why so, if the 6 month extension is still available according to RA 6768 I mentioned in my post from the article in the Subic Bulletin dated February 10, 2010? Get my point? I was just presenting the facts and of our experiences! It's just up to the individual who are interested in following it up! A lot of disabled individuals residing in the Philippines have limited income via their SSD pension and if they did have SSI, well they lose that living outside of the U.S.! So you see, some can not afford an agent because of their tight budget! How much more will it be harder for them to process their own 13a or 13g permanent resident visa on their own without the assistance of an agent and or family and friends? Maybe some BI officials are reading these posts and begin to assess if their offices are wheel chair accessible and do something about it ASAP! These handicapped people have something to whine and moan about!

[Travis]

coz sometimes retired people have nothing better to do I know coz I am retired

[UZI]

coz sometimes retired people have nothing better to do I know coz I am retired