Ph "broken And Lawless"

[Tom in Texas]

I agree with the general premise concerning the function of "law" and "protection" by the government as put forth by the article in question.... ... however, the author attempts to buttress that premise by citing two specific examples of violence... rather that citing statistics or other general data to support a conclusion that such violence is so pervasive in the PH as to justify the conclusion the PH is a "broken and lawless nation."There are numerous specific examples of similar violence occurring in nations which are not branded as "broken and lawless" -- such as - as I write this... CNN is reporting "breaking news" of 4 people gunned down at a St. Louis funeral home in front of the grieving mourners --- --- should I conclude that St. Louis is a "broken and lawless" city... and perhaps the USA a "broken and lawless" country.So, who agrees... or disagrees... with the conclusion of the Asian Human Rights Commission that the PH is a "BROKEN AND LAWLESS NATION"?http://www.ahrchk.ne...tatements/2903/FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE AHRC-STM-213-2010 October 27, 2010 A Statement by the Asian Human Rights Commission PHILIPPINES: A broken and lawless nation -- killing in front of families When a country's protection mechanism is no longer capable of protecting its own people, its own system is deeply flawed; when a society can no longer protect the people in their community, the bond of fraternity that binds human civilization is broken; and when killings are done in front of families it illustrates the breakdown and separation, not only for families who lost their loved ones, but of the family as part of the society and the country. It is an illusion, if it is not an absurdity for anyone to claim without fear and reservation, that there is protection and security for the people in the Philippines. It has become ordinary for killings to be carried out by policemen, the military and the paramilitary forces working for them; killing in broad daylight before witnesses in crowded public places and in front of the victim's family in their own homes. Hundreds, if not thousands of stories go unreported and this has been taking place in the country for many years now. What is left is an imagery of the existence of a nation, it exists in name only. The nation's fundamental existence is to protect and uphold the interest of each and every Filipino, who are themselves part of a family; a family that is part of a community; a community that is part of a society; and a society that composes the nation. The functioning of the country's institutions, by virtue of reason, is an agreement by the people who have come together to protect their shared interest: humanity. A system of justice was built and in the local context of the Philippines it is called the "Five pillars of the Criminal Justice System" (composed of the police, prosecution, judiciary, prisons and the community). The reason for its existence is not solely to protect and maintain the institutions; but for individuals who are part of this group of people--by birth, nationality or habitation--that is called the Philippines. All the Filipinos who compose this nation are subject to its rules. It is the protection and preservation of the rights of this individual and the group he is part of that is the reason for the existence of the system. But when the system of justice no longer functions for the protection of each individual, but rather an exclusive small group of people who are part of these institutions; and to protect the institution that they work for, the purpose of its existence has lost its meaning. The institutions may still survive but not for the reason for which they were originally built, but only to protect the interests of the people who are part of the system. Those who protect these systems are the very people who themselves do not feel protected and secured; thus, being part of it gives them protection so they protect its status quo. Therefore, the neglect and abandonment of the country's system is felt hard by people who are not within the system, but who were part of the original reason for its creation. But in reality, the system which they once had can no longer protect them unless they are within it. The system thrives not because it satisfies the individual or the group but rather because their physical existence justifies its need. An individual cannot create and subject himself to his own system and be a nation unto himself. In a country where an individual could no longer protect himself, he cannot protect his family; a family who cannot protect its members, cannot protect the community where they belong; and a person, a family and a community that cannot protect itself cannot protect a Nation. A Nation that cannot protect its own citizens, their families and the community where they live cannot hope to protect the foreigners on its soil. It is a broken and lawless nation. A system of justice can still continue to exist on paper, structure and appearance, but its existence is meaningless once it departs from its original role of being a protector, it becomes the very opposite of what it was supposed to be; that is the protector of those within the system, protecting those who are already protected; securing those who are already secured. This is the type system that each Filipino lives in daily in their own country. Unless there is a discussion and organic realization by those who are part of the system of the need for reform to reexamine their purpose, its existence remains an object of contempt. The murders of Reynaldo Labrador of Davao City and Vicente Felisilda of Mawab, Compostela Valley, who were both executed in front of their families illustrates how broken and lawless the country has become. These cases are documented by a local human rights group, Karapatan. Reynaldo Labrador: shot in front of his wife, childrenReynaldo was 39 years old... shot dead at 7:30 p.m. on September 3, 2010 in front of his wife, Leonisa and his daughters Reylon, 10; Raquel, 8; Jennifer, 4, at their home in Paquibato District, Davao City. ***Vicente Felisilda: shot in front of his brother Felisilda was 38 years old, a farmer with four children and member of a political party, Bayan Muna. On September 9, 2010 at 7pm, he and his elder brother... were resting, two gunmen arrived at the place. They were wearing plain clothes and armed with .45 caliber pistol. At first the two greeted the brothers and tried to make conversation with them by asking what they were doing. However, suddenly one of them shot Vicente at close range.... *** About AHRC: The Asian Human Rights Commission is a regional non-governmental organisation monitoring and lobbying human rights issues in Asia. The Hong Kong-based group was founded in 1984.

[Jake]

"A Nation that cannot protect its own citizens, their families and the community where they live cannot hope to protect the foreigners on its soil. It is a broken and lawless nation".Hey Counsel,The statement above from this human rights group based in Hong Kong is a bit over generalization. You and I can probably cite many pastand present criminal activities in the States that should put that so-called modern society to utter shame. The author should expand hisresearch beyond Asia before he condemns the Philippines.Respectfully -- Jake

[Genius]

Author is manifestly correct. The murder rate, (whether of journalists, tourists, political aspirants, urban poor), whether kept in statistical databalses by the philipine authorities or not, is far higher per capita than any other 1st world country I can think of. Looking at the third world, it is on par with south american drug states and the more lawless parts of africa. Trying to dispute the methodology of the author is also a peculiarly common tactic used by thee Philippine press, (well those who aren't being murdered). To deny that the Philippines is lawless and broken adminastrively, is a delusional state of mind, whatever the increase in crime one might have witnessed in ones home country over the years.

[Art2ro]

Just an observation in the past 12 yrs I've lived in the Philippines, has any one noticed the build up in troops in the PNP and the Military? It tells me that the Philippine government is aware of the lawlessness! They just have to get their sh&t together! Remember the Hong Kong bus hostages incident just a few months ago and the Missionary's Burmingham's blotched rescue from the Abu Sayaf by the military where the husband was killed by friendly fire because the Army and the Marine Commandants were arguing who was going to do the rescue for the glory? And the C.I.A. was there incognito all along monitoring the Abu Sayaf's every move from day one! What a fiasco of events, let alone embarrassing to show the whole world how screwed up things went! Did I say Hong Kong bus? I meant Chinese hostages on a Thai bus service in Manila! It was the Hong Kong Chinese Government officials that was bitching about the rescue gone wrong!

Edited December 1, 2010 by Fil/AmArt

[No name]

Author is manifestly correct. The murder rate, (whether of journalists, tourists, political aspirants, urban poor), whether kept in statistical databalses by the philipine authorities or not, is far higher per capita than any other 1st world country I can think of.

I'm willing to bet you a dollar you can't support that statement.Because it isn't true. Murder is far, far more common in the USA than it is in the Philippines.Now pick pockets and theft from clothes lines that's different. There is just no way the murder rate in the Philippines per capita is higher than the USA. I lived in Memphis before I left, a day without murder was a reason for news and that's just one city. Okay, I think it is less than one day but it the rate is more than one every other day.I live in Bogo City, we've had two murders this year. I think that's an increase of 200% over last year.Back it up Genius.

[No name]

Does anyone not get the connection to Hong Kong and the Manila Bus Hostage Crises? Hong Kong and China have been ripping on the Philippines ever since. Its political grand standing and this author is just writing a story to grab onto that train.

[Genius]

1/ I really do not believe the official figures coming out of the Philippines, (if you have faith in them, good luck to you). 2/ Having looked at the figures, I agree America is more violent, so I RETRACT as regards America, but rest of 1st world countries are substantially safer. (3 x more so). I never realised America was so violent. Surprises me!3/ But What you forget, is that foreigners are much more of a target in Phils than filipinos are in Phils, so murder rate for them is much higher. I think, otherwise, the deluge of foreigners being murdered confuses me somewhat. So, I stick to the general thesis that the Phils is a violent country, are you claiming that America is less lawful in general too ?Phillipines much more lawless in following respects.1. Reported crime rather than actual crime, (government so corrupt they lie left right and center2. Foreigners often targeted for different treatment , press is so prejudicial it is ridicolous, sometimes. Usually with motive of extravting money, I pass no moral censure, as it is a symptom of poorer country rather than being more criminally minded I believe. I m sure where you live in bogo is nice but it sounds more rural, probably why you feel safer there, in the big cities of Manila, outside of Makati etc it is not especially safe for a foreigner. In conclusion, I might of exaggerated on my first post, but general point remains.

Author is manifestly correct. The murder rate, (whether of journalists, tourists, political aspirants, urban poor), whether kept in statistical databalses by the philipine authorities or not, is far higher per capita than any other 1st world country I can think of.

I'm willing to be you a dollar you can't support that statement.Because it isn't true. Murder is far, far more common in the USA than it is in the Philippines.Now pick pockets and theft from clothes lines that's different. There is just no way the murder rate in the Philippines per capita is higher than the USA. I lived in Memphis before I left, a day without murder was a reason for news and that's just one city. Okay, I think it is less than one day but it the rate is more than one every other day.I live in Bogo City, we've had two murders this year. I think that's an increase of 200% over last year.Back it up Genius.

Edited December 1, 2010 by Genius

[Jake]

Hey guys,Below is a thread taken from the section Safety and Security, under the title "Another American shot dead in Angeles City"dated back in mid September, 2010 and my response to the global criminal activities: http://www.angelfire.../y/homicide.htm (submitted by member SJP52), which compares developed and undeveloped countries.Posted 21 September 2010 - 09:19 PMThank you guys for doing the research. Given the fact that USA has murder rate of 6.1 per capita (per 100,000 people), does that mean based on current population of say 300 million, the actual murders reported for the year 2009 is 6.1 x 3000 = 18,300 victims? Whereas, the murders in the Philippines is 4.31 x 900 = 3,879 victims (90 million divided by 100,000 x 4.31). Is my math out in left field??Respectfully -- Jake

[No name]

1/ I really do not believe the official figures coming out of the Philippines, (if you have faith in them, good luck to you). 2/ Having looked at the figures, I agree America is more violent, so I rertract as regards america, but rest of 1st world countries are substantially safer. (3 x more so). I never realised America was so violent.3/ But What you forget, is that foreigners are much more of a target in Phils than filipinos are in Phils, so murder rate for them is much higher. So, I stick to the general thesis that the Phils is a violent country, are you claiming that America is less lawful in general too ?Phillipines much more lawless in following respects.1. Reported crime rather than actual crime, (government so corrupt they lie left right and center2. Foreigners often targeted for different treatment , press is so prejudicial it is ridicolous, sometimes/I m sure where you live in bogo is nice but it sounds more rural, probably why you feel safer there.

Author is manifestly correct. The murder rate, (whether of journalists, tourists, political aspirants, urban poor), whether kept in statistical databalses by the philipine authorities or not, is far higher per capita than any other 1st world country I can think of.

I'm willing to be you a dollar you can't support that statement.Because it isn't true. Murder is far, far more common in the USA than it is in the Philippines.Now pick pockets and theft from clothes lines that's different. There is just no way the murder rate in the Philippines per capita is higher than the USA. I lived in Memphis before I left, a day without murder was a reason for news and that's just one city. Okay, I think it is less than one day but it the rate is more than one every other day.I live in Bogo City, we've had two murders this year. I think that's an increase of 200% over last year.Back it up Genius.

You restated it, you didn't back it up. You wont be able to because it is not close to true.i didn't say either place is lawless. I will stick with the violent crime rate in the USA is MUCH higher than what it is in the Philippines.Now there are other kinds of threats here, don't find many grenades lying around in the USA. Much more of those here. But then, the Philippines hasn't seen 3000 people killed in one single terror plot. There was massive loss of life though in one terror event here, it happens on a ferry and resulted in the largest loss of live in a maritime "disaster". There are problems here but violent crime is way down the lists. Corruption is way up the list especially compared to the USA.This idea of violent crime being greater in the Philippines is completely without merit.It is one of the most dangerous places in the world to be a politician or journalist. Your per capita chance of dying in those two fields is greatly elevated compared to the USA.There are some bad signs out there. Gang activity in Mandaue is way up. I'm sure other places, I've just read about it there.Bogo might be considered rural by some but it is a class three city. I live about 120Km north of Cebu City. I don't think you make much of a point. In fact, you made mine a little stronger.Last numbers I saw were about 78 million people in the Philippines. About 10 million of those are in Metro Manila. The other 68 million live mostly in rural Philippines where crime is low.People go to AC and to Manila and apply that to the rest of the country. It is grossly wrong to do so. The rest of the country isn't anything like those two places.

[No name]

I have looked high and low for numbers of per capita attacks on foreigners, can't find those numbers.I have wondered the same thing but I'm not willing to jump to conclusions. I think the rate of crime will rise on foreigners, but I don't carry a gun here nor do I feel the need too. When I lived in the USA, I went through the expense of getting a permit to carry a weapon and took it with me every where I went. When I had a garage sale before moving here, it was strapped to my side.The one number I have been able to find is about kidnapping. 70% of kidnapping victims are Filipino, mostly middle class. The gangs stay away from foreigners and rich Filipino because they carry to much press and thus cause the government to become more interested. The majority of kidnappings go unreported. Thus, what you hear about are the foreigners that are kidnapping making it appear they are more likely to be targeted when they are not.