Four Girls Rescued From Australian

[Markham]

Lee, I was responding to a more general point that Tom made - that you do tend to err on the side of the prosecution. In this case however, I believe the Australian was breaking the law - and he knew he was. This is, after all, not the first time he has demonstrated a penchant for young children.

I have to wonder why Mark feels that he should be investigated since the only connection seems to be that he lives so close to the Santos home, since Mark seems to think that Griffiths and Santos had nothing to do with the killing of Ellah Joy, so if not guilty of that crime, what would the close proximity of where this fellow lived to the Santos home have to do with the death of Ellah Joy? :unsure: Could it now be that Mark is suggesting this fellow could be guilty of killing Ellah Joy with no information even written to suggest a connection except where he lived? Could it be that the person who killed Ellah Joy was one who procured children for this fellow and something went terribly wrong? :unsure: I guess we may never know since there are so many possible scenarios. Maybe Mark can expand on what possible interconnect he thinks there seems to be? [.

Right now I would suggest that anyone caught in flagrante delicto with young children should be thoroughly investigated vis-a-vis the Ellah Joy case, given the tenuousness of the evidence against Griffiths and Santos. If this case were being investigated in the UK, the Australian would be so investigated, if only to rule him out of any participation in Ellah's dreadful fate; I'd suggest the same would be true if the NYPD were the investigators. That is prudent police work. Griffiths, highly educated and well-respected, was married and has children - he may even be a grandfather - and Santos is married (albeit separated) and has two children (her husband and children live in the US). Are they better fits for the murder of Ellah Joy than this kiddie-fiddling Australian? Now do you understand why I believe there may be an interconnect that needs to be investigated? Mark

[Mr Lee]

Now do you understand why I believe there may be an interconnect that needs to be investigated? Mark

Sorry, not really Mark, if we feel this Australian should be investigated for a crime which there is no sign he might have been involved in, then maybe they will feel that since one foreigner is bad, maybe we all are bad, so lets investigate them all, and that is what worries me the most, every time another one of us gets arrested. Also this particular guy was said to have been with teenage girls, and if I remember correctly Ellah Joy was much younger, so from what has been reported, there does not appear to be any pattern that would lead me to believe he might be involved with the killing of Ellah Joy, but maybe I missed something, and that is why I asked.

[Markham]

Now do you understand why I believe there may be an interconnect that needs to be investigated? Mark

Sorry, not really Mark, if we feel this Australian should be investigated for a crime which there is no sign he might have been involved in, then maybe they will feel that since one foreigner is bad, maybe we all are bad, so lets investigate them all, and that is what worries me the most, every time another one of us gets arrested. Also this particular guy was said to have been with teenage girls, and if I remember correctly Ellah Joy was much younger, so from what has been reported, there does not appear to be any pattern that would lead me to believe he might be involved with the killing of Ellah Joy, but maybe I missed something, and that is why I asked.

Ok so on what basis then do you believe Griffiths and Santos are guilty? Absolutely no evidence was found of any association with child pornography or any other form of child abuse. The USB memory stick found at Santos' house belongs to a computer technician who is also a photographer. Santos' computer and those belonging to Griffiths were checked (in Griffiths' case, thoroughly checked by a computer forensics expert) and nothing untoward was found. In addition, Griffiths' details would have been checked against the huge list of names gathered by Operation Ore (if you've not heard of it, Google it!). He was clean and hence not detained by the Police. The so-called evidence against this pair has been entirely fabricated, in my view - and I do have some justification for saying that (but I'm not in a position of giving you a better explanation right now). Mark

[Mr Lee]

Now do you understand why I believe there may be an interconnect that needs to be investigated? Mark

Sorry, not really Mark, if we feel this Australian should be investigated for a crime which there is no sign he might have been involved in, then maybe they will feel that since one foreigner is bad, maybe we all are bad, so lets investigate them all, and that is what worries me the most, every time another one of us gets arrested. Also this particular guy was said to have been with teenage girls, and if I remember correctly Ellah Joy was much younger, so from what has been reported, there does not appear to be any pattern that would lead me to believe he might be involved with the killing of Ellah Joy, but maybe I missed something, and that is why I asked.

Ok so on what basis then do you believe Griffiths and Santos are guilty? Absolutely no evidence was found of any association with child pornography or any other form of child abuse. The USB memory stick found at Santos' house belongs to a computer technician who is also a photographer. Santos' computer and those belonging to Griffiths were checked (in Griffiths' case, thoroughly checked by a computer forensics expert) and nothing untoward was found. In addition, Griffiths' details would have been checked against the huge list of names gathered by Operation Ore (if you've not heard of it, Google it!). He was clean and hence not detained by the Police. The so-called evidence against this pair has been entirely fabricated, in my view - and I do have some justification for saying that (but I'm not in a position of giving you a better explanation right now). Mark

I think we will have to wait until it goes to court for the evidence to be brought to light, up until that point all we can do is speculate and have personal feelings on the case based on info that we believe is either there, or not there, depending on ones POV. I have my feelings based on what I think I know, and you have your feelings based on what you think you know. I have continually said that I do not know if they are guilty of the crime or not, but my point has been that people can be guilty and not proven guilty, and the reverse is also true, yet we may never find out as long as miss Santos keeps hiding. As far as Griffiths being a fine upstanding citizen, I do not doubt that, but many a fine upstanding citizen with great credentials has been found to have a hidden side, so again we may never know what evidence the prosecution should or might be holding back, until and if they spring it at the trial, but none of this has anything to do with this topic. added, as quoted from THIS story

Saniel-Amit said these acts would lead to psychological, emotional, physical, and social effects on a child that may result to depression, poor self-esteem, dissociative, anxiety, school problems, animal cruelty, and could possibly lead to committing suicide.She claimed they found many victims here in Cebu after the recovery of children’s pictures in the USB owned by Bella Ruby Santos, one of the suspects in the killing of Ellah Joy Pique.

Edited August 25, 2011 by Kuya Lee
add

[Markham]

I think we will have to wait until it goes to court for the evidence to be brought to light, up until that point all we can do is speculate and have personal feelings on the case based on info that we believe is either there, or not there, depending on ones POV. I have my feelings based on what I think I know, and you have your feelings based on what you think you know. I have continually said that I do not know if they are guilty of the crime or not, but my point has been that people can be guilty and not proven guilty, and the reverse is also true, yet we may never find out as long as miss Santos keeps hiding. As far as Griffiths being a fine upstanding citizen, I do not doubt that, but many a fine upstanding citizen with great credentials has been found to have a hidden side, so again we may never know what evidence the prosecution should or might be holding back, until and if they spring it at the trial, but none of this has anything to do with this topic.

Sorry to burst this bubble but even here in the Philippines there are strict rules of disclosure so neither the prosecution nor the defence can stage ambushes.

added, as quoted from THIS story

Saniel-Amit said these acts would lead to psychological, emotional, physical, and social effects on a child that may result to depression, poor self-esteem, dissociative, anxiety, school problems, animal cruelty, and could possibly lead to committing suicide.She claimed they found many victims here in Cebu after the recovery of children’s pictures in the USB owned by Bella Ruby Santos, one of the suspects in the killing of Ellah Joy Pique.

The ownership of the USB memory stick is contested and Santos has repeatedly stated it belongs to her computer repair technician who left it at her house by mistake. He, apparently, is a part-time semi-professional photographer. Mark

[Mr Lee]

Sorry to burst this bubble but even here in the Philippines there are strict rules of disclosure so neither the prosecution nor the defence can stage ambushes.

We shall see.

The ownership of the USB memory stick is contested and Santos has repeatedly stated it belongs to her computer repair technician who left it at her house by mistake. He, apparently, is a part-time semi-professional photographer. Mark

Yeah, like she is going to say it was hers. So far I have not seen anywhere that the photographer admitted the stick was his and why would the child advocate have said they found many victims here in Cebu if they were just everyday photos. Again we will see, or at least hear about exactly what photos were in the stick, when and if the trial begins.

[Markham]

The ownership of the USB memory stick is contested and Santos has repeatedly stated it belongs to her computer repair technician who left it at her house by mistake. He, apparently, is a part-time semi-professional photographer. Mark

Yeah, like she is going to say it was hers. So far I have not seen anywhere that the photographer admitted the stick was his and why would the child advocate have said they found many victims here in Cebu if they were just everyday photos. Again we will see, or at least hear about exactly what photos were in the stick, when and if the trial begins.

Actually:

]She claimed they found many victims here in Cebu after the recovery of children’s pictures in the USB owned by Bella Ruby Santos, one of the suspects in the killing of Ellah Joy Pique.

Nowhere does it say that the photographs weren't ordinary, everyday pictures - simply that some of them were of victims of child abuse. That abuse could very well have been inflicted upon them by members of their families. Apart from a CD cover - that allegedly had "pornographic" images on it - the Police found nothing incriminating on any discs belonging to Santos or on Griffiths' desktop and laptop PCs. Strange that the PNP never found the CD itself. I suggest that CD case was planted. But no doubt you will poo-poo that idea as preposterous - like it could never happen! Mark

[Mr Lee]

I suggest that CD case was planted. But no doubt you will poo-poo that idea as preposterous - like it could never happen! Mark

Nope, I would never say it cannot happen, that is one thing I learned during my years of life, anything is possible.

[Jollygoodfellow]

Lee, I was responding to a more general point that Tom made - that you do tend to err on the side of the prosecution. In this case however, I believe the Australian was breaking the law - and he knew he was. This is, after all, not the first time he has demonstrated a penchant for young children.

I have to wonder why Mark feels that he should be investigated since the only connection seems to be that he lives so close to the Santos home, since Mark seems to think that Griffiths and Santos had nothing to do with the killing of Ellah Joy, so if not guilty of that crime, what would the close proximity of where this fellow lived to the Santos home have to do with the death of Ellah Joy? :unsure: Could it now be that Mark is suggesting this fellow could be guilty of killing Ellah Joy with no information even written to suggest a connection except where he lived? Could it be that the person who killed Ellah Joy was one who procured children for this fellow and something went terribly wrong? :shooter: I guess we may never know since there are so many possible scenarios. Maybe Mark can expand on what possible interconnect he thinks there seems to be? [.

Right now I would suggest that anyone caught in flagrante delicto with young children should be thoroughly investigated vis-a-vis the Ellah Joy case, given the tenuousness of the evidence against Griffiths and Santos. If this case were being investigated in the UK, the Australian would be so investigated, if only to rule him out of any participation in Ellah's dreadful fate; I'd suggest the same would be true if the NYPD were the investigators. That is prudent police work. Griffiths, highly educated and well-respected, was married and has children - he may even be a grandfather - and Santos is married (albeit separated) and has two children (her husband and children live in the US). Are they better fits for the murder of Ellah Joy than this kiddie-fiddling Australian? Now do you understand why I believe there may be an interconnect that needs to be investigated? Mark

Can I just refer to the forum rules,the last part here concerning the use of English, LanguageMembers are not allowed to use bad language on this forum; please show respect to all other members including women. Posts must be written in English. Ohhh,,,, my mistake,it is English,mods feel free to delete this post when I finish laughing :unsure: :nudie: :lmao: